Shouldn’t Conservatives Support Habeas Corpus?
Especially those who like to fashion themselves as “strict constructionists”. It goes back as far as the Magna Carta. However, for supporting it, Barack Obama is called “naive” and “delusional” by John McCain’s camp. And that’s because Obama supports the Supreme Court decision that supports Habeaus Corpus for detainees. So, does that mean that five justices who voted to uphold this tradition are also “naive” and “delusional”? And what credibility is there among McBush supporters who accuse Obama of “a September 10 mindset”? As Obama says:
“Let’s think about this: These are the same guys who helped engineer the distraction of the war in Iraq at a time when we could have pinned down the people who actually committed 9/11.
“What they’re trying to do is what they’ve done every election cycle, which is to use terrorism as a club to make the American people afraid.”
Thank God for this man. He has rekindled my hope for this country.
(you too, Alan)
June 18th, 2008 at 12:39 pm
I think the usa is at a point where “anything goes” the minute you give constitutional rights to prisoners who are not on american soil,you are just asking for MORE trouble. If you ask me the wrong people are behind bars.
CUBA the 52nd state???????
June 18th, 2008 at 1:03 pm
Shouldn’t ethical people support habeas corpus? I assume that’s what you really want to ask, and the answer is a resounding yes.
June 18th, 2008 at 1:12 pm
Errr…ODD…Gitmo IS US soil as much as any other US base would be considered US soil.
June 18th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
If gitmo were us soil as you claim our gov. would not be second guessing legal rights as they are now for prisoners. cuba [last time i checked] is or was ruled by dictatorship. no democrocy has been established as of today. errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
June 18th, 2008 at 1:33 pm
The fact that it cannot be readily dismissed as US soil is also why it’s legitimate to inquiry as to the rights of detainees, and default to the assumption that they have some, equal or near to those of recognized US citizens, until the matter is resolved.
June 18th, 2008 at 1:55 pm
The Panama Canal Zone isn’t US soil either, yet McCain was born there and is considered US soil for THAT purpose.
???
Can’t have it both ways.
June 18th, 2008 at 1:59 pm
they really need more identicons.
June 18th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Habeas Corpus?? Repugs don’t need no stinking “Habeas Corpus”!
Torture away! Destroy the non-white people! And the women? Keep ‘em barefoot and pregnant.
Now THAT’S the republican way!
June 18th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Is that what they want? Couldn’t they keep them shirtless and less pregnant? Feet do nothing for me.
June 18th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
Ladies, I sure could use a flash of inspiration. Hallelujah.
June 18th, 2008 at 2:12 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw2nkoGLhrE
June 18th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
Classic one, Michael.
June 18th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
And BTW boogieman,the panama canal was sold by the carter adm. to the repub. of panama.
dont know what to tell ya about birth records of mc cain.
June 18th, 2008 at 2:48 pm
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080618/ap_en_tv/michelle_obama_the_view
Feel the classiness people. Alan, thou shalt post about this.
June 18th, 2008 at 3:01 pm
TDro, “destroy the non-white people?” Isn’t that a little racist on your part?
June 18th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
In the America the conservatives are playing to how many people can spell “Habeas Corpus?” They think we are saying “Hocus Pokus” and that’s what makes the terrorists disappear. Common sense defeats logic here because America doesn’t care what happens to someone accused or is actually guilty of attacking this country. Common sense defeats all the logic in the world when that world is driven by fear and waving a flag. Ever watch Jerry Springer when the crowd is in a frenzy throwing chairs? Jerry doesn’t even go on stage. It’s not time for his monologue. Conservative thought rules!
June 18th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
So the minute we step OFF American soil we leave behind morality and religion and the constitution and everything America is supposed to stand for and we can just kill and maim and rape and plunder and behave in every way like these animals who wrap themselves in a shroud of Islamic blather to excuse the crimes they commit?
June 18th, 2008 at 3:48 pm
No habeus corpus… if that means taking no prisoners and killing them on capture I have no problem with that.
June 18th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Some conservatives who bash the ACLU fail to realize what the CL stands for. They fail to understand that CL stands for Civil Liberties. You know the Liberty that we are supposedly bringing to Iraq. You know the Liberty that our soldiers are supposed to be fighting to protect. The conservatives who want Liberty seem to separate or detach themselves from the principles that the ACLU stands and fights to uphold or protect. Liberty is Liberty; from the First Amendment to the last they are all worth fighting for. The hateful vigor with which some conservatives or Republicans refer to the ACLU with is odd, if not illogical. Do they care about free speech, due process of law, equal protection under the law, the right to vote, freedom of religion, gun ownership, or the right to protest, because those are all Liberties. Conservatives should realize that the ACLU does not discriminate between Conservative vs. Liberal, they will represent and fight for all Americans Liberties, our Rights. Liberties are not Liberal or Conservative they are self-evident concepts or principles that our founding fathers knew would be needed in order for a free societies existence.
June 18th, 2008 at 5:34 pm
McCain and Political Pundits are not mentioning the fact that the recent Supreme Court ruling concerning the due process rights of government detainees is not so much about foreign enemy combatants; rather it is about all possible enemy combatants. What the American public does not realize nor have they been told is that any American Citizen can be designated an enemy combatant by the White House on nothing more than mere suspicion. So the issue is can the right of the due process of law that is guaranteed by the constitution be denied. Can an American have their right to hear the evidence against them, the right to a speedy trial by a jury of their peers, the right to access to legal council, and all the other due process aspects afforded them? We had better have those rights. But before the Supreme Court ruling foreign suspected enemy combatants and suspected American enemy combatants had no right to constitutional equal protection of law. The President had thrown out the right to be proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and replaced it with guilty by suspicion without due process. As well anyone American or foreigner could be held forever with out first being proven guilty of being an enemy combatant. The treatment of all potential enemy combatants meant that all American Citizens had lost the equal protection of the law and the protection of the principle of due process of law. That is what is so conveniently left out of the conversation. What a shame that pundits are leaving out the important details which would allow Americans the ability to decide why the Court ruled the way they did.
June 18th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Hey John David Prince, we don’t need an essay. Try to limit your responses to 3 screens of words.
Thank you…and Good Night.
June 18th, 2008 at 6:09 pm
The Politics of Fear alive and well again. Stupid fucking Republicans. Remember the 2006 election when Bush said “If the Democrats get control of Congress, the terrorists win and America loses.” How did that turn out? McCain can shove both his hands up his ass…
June 18th, 2008 at 6:13 pm
WFG said: “Is that what they want? Couldn’t they keep them shirtless and less pregnant? Feet do nothing for me.”
LOL, you’re silly boy!
FuryUs~ That’s John David Prince’s way. He pops in every now and then, leaving a few essays on various threads, and does not interact with us. He just leaves the essay and rolls out until he feels like coming back. He has refused to respond to previous requests to limit his comments, or to at least break that shit up into readable paragraphs.
June 18th, 2008 at 6:59 pm
I believe Prince has limited himself on occasion, but for the most part not.
June 18th, 2008 at 7:00 pm
“…taking no prisoners and killing them on capture…”
So American forces should follow the example of the 1st SS Panzer Division which massacred American P.O.W.s during World War Two?
Or maybe we should do like the Imperial Japanese Army when they invaded Nanking?
Anger and vengeance is what got us into this disaster known as the Bush “foreign policy”.
It’s high time we all started thinking.
June 18th, 2008 at 7:06 pm
if by “limit” you mean that one time his post was only the size of 3 paragraphs smushed together, then you’re right.
June 18th, 2008 at 7:08 pm
I appreciate John David prince’s contributions. They are informed and logical. Thank you sir!
June 18th, 2008 at 8:18 pm
I agree, it’s this sound-byte mentality without any interest in anything that doesn’t fit on a bumper sticker that has reduced the election process to a cynical clinical professional marketing battle. Read the entire Supreme Court decision and learn something for once, you two-faced constitutionalists-when-it-fits-your-platform.
June 18th, 2008 at 10:55 pm
Flap:
I’ve watched enough of Fox “News” to know that conservatives and republicans are racists (just like you, I’m sure).
June 18th, 2008 at 11:06 pm
Flap isn’t a racist. Not all conservatives are racist.
Remember the WV and KY primaries, TDro? Quite a few whites voted for Clinton bc they weren’t down with a brother in the WH.
June 19th, 2008 at 1:08 am
The Panama Canal Zone was never ours in the first place.
We leased it and it goes back at the end of that lease.
Carter returned it early, IIRC.
June 19th, 2008 at 2:49 am
how about we built the panama canal? alot of american lives were sacraficed to complete the project therefore ……No lease
Class Dismissed
June 19th, 2008 at 3:10 am
Cheryl Carroll:
I remember the WV and KY primaries. Do you remember that Mr. Loveable Rush Limbaugh asked his listeners to vote for Hillary because he was trying to screw up the election? From what I’ve read many of his listeners did just that.
My mistake. Flap isn’t a racist, he’s a misogynist.
June 19th, 2008 at 11:33 am
This site is amazing. The views are so slanted and the comments so rude.
Neither Obama or McCain represent my moderate views, and again I question how a country of 250 million can find 2 people, so so so limited in their skills to lead. Our founding fathers were from a population of 3 million. Can’t we find just one person with those talents and vision amongst our masses? guess not.
Watching them speak I suspect Obama will win the election as he has more appeal. Whatever mistakes or concerns brought up about him, appear to be brushed aside by most people. Media is definitely on his side which should be a huge benefit.
But, on the negative side he fails the test of “show me your friends and I will know who you are”. His life-long adult friends seem more radical and hateful than an average American, let alone a person that wants to be President. I don’t think that’s enough for him to lose the election as most people simply don’t find it relevant or weren’t raised with advice that my parents gave to me.
They both have HORRIBLE immigration reform ideas. Billions going to support Hispanic immigrants that are not assimilating into America after 2 or 3 generations. To many rights for illegals and expanding our population faster than anytime in our history. We don’t have the resources to handle the mass population explosion coming in the next 20 years.
Neither have the vision to see the economic threat China is to the U.S.
I could care less who marries another person so not the least bit interested in their gay marriage views.
And I recognize Bush has made more mistakes than possibly any President since FDR. So, that’s another reason Obama will win. McCain is going to be compared to Bush and lose the election.
But, my vote will be for McCain. He is definitely not my #1 choice, but he is the most logical of the two. For one reason he grasps the concept of fighting an enemy on their territory versus U.S. soil and the enemy is not one that will negotiate as normal humans. They have one goal—to kill Americans.
Primarily I must vote for McCain because of his belief in personal accountability. To many Americans have come to believe the government is an answer to all their problems………education, jobs, health care, welfare, etc.
And, he does not have the support of the ACLU. And whoever that organization supports I immediately get worried.
When I see our urban areas being unsafe, violent, over run by gangs, I can only imagine the amount of my tax dollars that will go into those communities that take no personal responsibility for their conduct.
Obama will expand the national goverment beyond anything we’ve seen before. But, it will be for social programs that most hard working Americans will never see or use.
But, just in case Obama loses by a whisker I’ll be prepared for the day after election riots that will spread across our country.
And if he does win there will be no riots, but I suspect in a couple years or sooner I’ll be watching terrorists attacks on our country. That may please his friends, but it sure won’t do much for our future.
Moderate!
June 22nd, 2008 at 3:00 am
Obama is exposing himself as a liar day after day. From everything I hear Democrats are fleeing toward McCain.
June 22nd, 2008 at 3:23 am
If Democrats are moving to McCain it sure isn’t appearing that way in the polls.
I welcome them with open arms.
Those that ignore his associates, excessive promises, social program agenda, illegal immigration policies, and lack of respect for this country……………………those people are almost as scary as he is.
He is a politician so lying is his job.
But, Americans that believe in him and all his promises and faults are blind, stupid, or hate George Bush so much they’d vote for the devil before voting for a Republican.
June 22nd, 2008 at 3:57 am
This URL is the master URL of all the affliated groups of Democrats who are voting for McCain.
http://www.justsaynodeal.com/
June 22nd, 2008 at 4:22 am
They’re voting against Obama, not for McCain.
June 22nd, 2008 at 4:23 am