John McCain Supports A Draft
And I don’t mean a draft for president. We’re talking about a military draft. At the end of this very long statement at a town hall in Las Cruces, NM, John McCain agrees with the questioner, who concludes with:
AUDIENCE MEMBER: If we don’t reenact the draft I don’t think we will have anyone to chase Bin Laden to the gates of hell.
JOHN MCCAIN: Ma’am let me say that I don’t disagree with anything you said and thank you and I am grateful for your support of all of our veterans.
Jon Soltz of votevets.org says:
“When you take into account his indefinite military commitment to Iraq, his desire to send more troops to Afghanistan, record lows in recruiting and retention, and possibly more wars he is looking to get into, like “Bomb Bomb Bomb” Iran, his numbers don’t add up without a draft. Whether America likes it or not isn’t relevant – a draft is the only way to do everything Senator McCain wants to do. I give him points for being honest and upfront, though, that we’re going to need a draft if he is elected.”
This is a shame. Wake up America, McCain will take all of your children and through them into this unnecessary war in Iraq.
August 20th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
While you are on your winning streak of displaying a vertebrae, you’d best bring this up on your show even if you have to smuggle it into one of your sidekick Herr Goering’s rants on your candidate. Don’t go getting castrati on us Alan.
August 20th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
Never mind Iraq or Osama, McBush is only planning the staffing for future military operations against Pooty-Poot.
Las Cruces is a beautiful town. The climb up US70 out of town and on the way to Alamogordo used to give the ol’ Detroit a real, screamin’ workout.
August 20th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
This will definitely be McCain’s downfall. If people of draft age hear this, they will show up to the polls in droves for Obama.
To Nixon’s benefit, the best thing he ever did when he was in office was to abolish the draft.
August 20th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
And maybe the ACLU will sue Selective Service for only drafting men. Wouldn’t that be fun?
August 20th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
And maybe the ACLU will come to your defense when you’re arrested for trying to pick up men in an airport restroom.
August 20th, 2008 at 4:50 pm
He’s hinted at a one term Presidency, now the draft. Good luck, coward…
August 20th, 2008 at 4:51 pm
Maybe someone needs to tell McCain RISK is a board game, not reality. You don’t just keep invading countries for the hell of it. We already had a country that did that. The Soviet Union. Constant wars had a lot to do with their downfall. Contrary to popular belief, the Soviet Union did not fall because Reagan stared at them…
August 20th, 2008 at 4:54 pm
McCain is a coward…
August 20th, 2008 at 5:02 pm
Mr Colmes, question for you?
What is Fox news doing to bring the truthful McCain out to the public light?. How comes you let “little Hannity” get away with anything he wants to say?, why don’t you invite for democrats to your show? I like the show and I have to give you 2 thumbs up for dealing with a jerk like Hannity every day…
now, the draft: of course it is what he wants… listen why he is running for president: “to inspire a new generation of americans to serve a cause greater than their self interest”, so look at the situation with russia, all of this is Mr Bush’s present to a Mr McCain’s administration.
August 20th, 2008 at 5:12 pm
I love that the ACLU battled on Homophobic Hannity’s behalf once.
“Hannity hosted his first talk radio show in 1989 at the volunteer college station at UC Santa Barbara, KCSB-FM, while working as a general contractor. The show aired for 40 hours of air time;[6] Hannity has since called the show “terrible.”[7] Hannity’s weekly show on KCSB was canceled after less than a year when management charged him with “discriminating against gays and lesbians.” This was after two shows featuring the book The AIDS Coverup: The Real and Alarming Facts about AIDS by Gene Antonio. The station later reversed its decision to dismiss Hannity due in part to a campaign conducted by the Santa Barbara Chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union.”
At least McCain actually has military service. Unfortunately, he wants to re-enact the draft on an unpopular, dishonorable war waged on false pretenses by a president and v.p. who avoided the draft completely when it was their time to “serve their country” in a foreign land.
August 20th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
As I understand it, the producers select the guests, though I doubt Alan is without influence. If that’s the case, the biases of the produces, if you assume they don’t choose to continue to book guests based on ratings after the initial tryout of a guest, is the real issue.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,77538,00.html
August 20th, 2008 at 5:22 pm
Why not just let Exxon Mobile and Halliburton pay for more Blackwater troops?
August 20th, 2008 at 6:27 pm
McCain does not want the draft. In 2008 the USA is made up of lazy slackers, traitors, whiners, black separatists, etc
The argument of a draft requires a society that is capable or interested in defending itself. Even as punishment on the slackers, its not feasible from a security standpoint.
The military should remain all volunteer meaning people who… volunteer.
Now anyone with children right now? the programs to instill pro military values have already been taking place in shows, video games and other covert places in society so in another 18 years we can invoke the draft. To the stupid woman who made the asinine whining video on youtube about her baby will not be taken by the military? she should be put on watch as a possible communist.
August 20th, 2008 at 6:33 pm
“To the stupid woman who made the asinine whining video on youtube about her baby will not be taken by the military? she should be put on watch as a possible communist.”
Ohhhh, I totally knew it! I knew that’s where all this misplaced reverence for Joe McCarthy was going! The commmies are back and redder than ever! Ironically, the Red-State Party will be huntin’ down the reds and burnin’ the pinkos!
Suspend your civil rights, or be declared un-American! Stake-burnings to commence at dusk, so grab your weenies, my Republican friends, and bring your family values to the next Cross-Burning and Commie Roast (to benefit the Office of Faith Based Intitiatives)!
We’ll begin with an invocation by that most wonderful of Republican Party contributors, the Rev. Sun Myung Moon.
Praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition!
August 20th, 2008 at 6:52 pm
Hey Bradley, you judgemental prick, how long have you been in the military?
August 20th, 2008 at 6:54 pm
If only the pussy cons served instead of bashing everyone. Bwadwee, you’re post is so fucking ignorant. You sound like a complete ass…
August 20th, 2008 at 7:06 pm
Bradly didn’t serve, Fury. He’s nothing but a tough talking coward who would be the first to leave the country if they reinstated the draft.
August 20th, 2008 at 8:41 pm
People thought I was crazy when I said that if McCain is elected and we get into another dumb war with Iran, there’s going to be a draft. And guess who will be of age?
August 20th, 2008 at 9:09 pm
His post above. Taking the Phil Gramm approach. Don’t just insult the left, insult the entire country. What a coward piece of shit…
whassup TDro
August 20th, 2008 at 9:11 pm
Don’t forget about the war with Russia now. McCain’s false bravado is going to create another Cold War. The nukes didn’t disappear from Russia…
August 20th, 2008 at 9:13 pm
With the exception of the civil war, the revolutionary war and WW11 were the ONLY wars of self defense that we fought.
August 20th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
“I love that the ACLU battled on Homophobic Hannity’s behalf once.”
……………………………..
No matter how much thet bash it, everyone turns to the ACLU when they need it.
August 20th, 2008 at 9:25 pm
We got lots of room in Canada..I guess the old border’s gonna be hopping again just like the ‘Nam years..
Unless we start the fence now…:)
.
.
August 20th, 2008 at 11:04 pm
Moat on the Canadian border…
August 21st, 2008 at 12:47 am
hey thats great! there will be people dancing in the streets if all the liberals go to live in canada. you see thats the most cowardly thing i have ever heard. this country has made people fat and stupid. we need a draft to make these slacker teenagers real men. after all this country has done for us, we should be available to further this country’s foreign ambitions. i am no vagina, so sign me up if necessary.
August 21st, 2008 at 1:08 am
Yup, put the peeps in the hoods of the gettos of America to WORK with their guns. Problem with that?!
Better theach them to speak english first!
Right MR.Obomber Barak Heuissein.?
August 21st, 2008 at 1:35 am
Is this where I comment on the stream? If it’s not I’m getting an error to enter a name, although I am.
August 21st, 2008 at 9:51 am
Now it’s working so just like never mind. =p
August 21st, 2008 at 9:53 am
Hey, Jerrysrollin! The military is looking for a few good men. You’re sure anxious to send others off to fight Why not enlist yourself? Are you chicken, a coward, are you yellow?
You chickens sure love to talk a big game, but when it comes to playing for the team, you run and hide behind your mother’s skirts.
You’re useless.
August 21st, 2008 at 11:59 am
And maybe the ACLU will come to your defense when you’re arrested for trying to pick up men in an airport restroom.
Gay bashing.
Nice one TDRO.
August 21st, 2008 at 12:26 pm
WAR FOREVER! U-S-A! U-S-A!
August 21st, 2008 at 12:38 pm
Why not just let Exxon Mobile and Halliburton pay for more Blackwater troops?
Exxon, a company with a 8% profit margin gets all the blame. NEVER mentioned is google and their profit margin.
Why do liberals ONLY mention halliburton and ALWAYS ignore URS Corp?
August 21st, 2008 at 12:40 pm
No matter how much thet bash it, everyone turns to the ACLU when they need it.
NAMBLA… ’nuff said.
August 21st, 2008 at 12:41 pm
if all the liberals go to live in canada.
It’s just tough talk.
Remember how many liberlas said they would move if bush was re-elected?
Yet none did.
August 21st, 2008 at 12:43 pm
PBAROSSO, make no mistake, you ARE a vagina, because you’re clearly under the control of the Neocon Religious Right if you’re part of the Republican Party (which seeks to control ALL vaginas).
As a GOP vagina, I’m sure you’ll follow our fearless President’s previous requests NOT to engage in premarital sex, use birth control of any kind, and have many little Republican boys and girls.
(Worse than making people fat and stupid, is the Republican way of making people fat in the head and stupid in action. So I’ll agree with your assessment on the GOP’s anti-intellectual approaches, certainly.)
August 21st, 2008 at 2:08 pm
Truth2Power, NAMBLA’s right to free speech was defended by the ACLU, same as Homophobic Hannity’s hateful spew. I mean, obviously, the ACLU didn’t advocate Homophobic Hannity’s hateful spew anymore than what NAMBLA was advocating.
I thought Republicans LIKED free speech? They’re always harping about the unfairness of the Fairness Doctrine (which would’ve been 60 next year. So much for Neocon reverence for the integrity and traditions of our forefathers).
God doesn’t like it when his children misrepresent things. It’s akin to lying. Like lying to everyone that a Christian American is a muslim.
If you said you were a Christian, I’d give you the benefit of the doubt, even though your actions as a Republican belie that.
August 21st, 2008 at 2:28 pm
By the way, at least 30,000 Americans have moved to Canada in the past few years, many citing political and social reasons.
August 21st, 2008 at 2:32 pm
< Exxon, a company with a 8% profit margin gets all the blame. NEVER mentioned is google and their profit margin.
Why do liberals ONLY mention halliburton and ALWAYS ignore URS Corp?
Posted by Truth2Power
August 21st, 2008 at 12:40 pm
…………………………………………………………………………………………
People can do WITHOUT google, middle class and the working poor NEED Exxon’s product. If Google price gouges the people, they can thumb their nose. Not so with oil.
Nobody had to die for Google’s profits.
URS Corp is # 10 on the list of The 25 Most Vicious Iraq War Profiteers:
10. URS Corporation
Another widely disparaged, Blum-controlled company that has profited from Iraq is URS Corporation. Long known as one of the nation’s major defense contractors, San Francisco-based URS has collected $792 million in environmental cleanup fees in Iraq war zones. As with Perini, both Blum and Feinstein have come under intense scrutiny to answer questions about the apparent conflict of interest inherent in Feinstein helping to secure such an exorbitant government contract for her investment banker husband. Both Blum and Feinstein have refused to produce copies of the ethics commitee’s rulings on Perini and URS, leading to considerable suspicion.
Many liberals are very angry at Diane Feinstein.
Halliburton gets SO much criticism because the conflict of interest that is presented when Cheney profits from Halliburton, then comes into the government and makes war policy that benefits Halliburton is rivaled only by third world countries.
< “Remember how many liberlas said they would move if bush was re-elected?
Yet none did.”
…………………………………………………………………………………………..
A few did. I think that’s silly.
You stay and fight for your country, and not just turn it over to those you think will ruin it.
You don’t leave the baby with an abusive babysitter, even though people trash you for calling the babysitter abusive.
< “No matter how much thet bash it, everyone turns to the ACLU when they need it.
NAMBLA… ’nuff said.”
………………………………………………………………………………….
The ACLU takes all free speech cases.
They made it clear that what NAMBLA DOES is illegal, but what they SAY is not.
If no one protects the speech of the MOST despicable, what happens when it’s the PRETTY despicable, then the SOMEWHAT despicable, then before we know it…the Pat Robertsons and Al Sharptons get to decide.
Free speech is easy if you protect only speech that MOST people agree is OK.
REAL free speech protects even speech that is loathsome to 99.99999999999999999% .
The ACLU also a went to bat for Rush Limbaugh and Oliver North.
August 21st, 2008 at 2:39 pm
Ollie North….Wonder what kinds of files today’s Fawn Hall is smuggling out in her knee-high boots these days?
August 21st, 2008 at 3:02 pm
Ohhhh, I totally knew it! I knew that’s where all this misplaced reverence for Joe McCarthy was going!
Yes Joe McCarthy was a great American hero. who would say otherwise?
we really do need to crack down on communist leaning types, who are politically on the…? LEFT! yes its true, democrats/liberals are the types of people who end up going full on communist.
TDro, Bradly didn’t serve, Fury. He’s nothing but a tough talking coward who would be the first to leave the country if they reinstated the draft.
so you enjoy telling lies if its easier to tell the truth?
Id like there to be a military draft, and Id like to have congress make laws to invoke into the armed forces, that dopey woman’s (the commie) baby from youtube who whined about her baby saying “you cant have him” as soon as he turns whatever the entry age is in the years ahead.
there SHOULD be a draft, but the spread of communists in America, we see them mostly in liberal blogs whining about whatever, they should be forced into the military but its a security risk and requires extra overhead to evaluate and track them. Until the chip can be implanted into all those who are drafted so they CAN be monitored and tracked? we just dont need the draft.
August 21st, 2008 at 4:12 pm
hey Ollie North HAD to shred documents because democrats in congress (communists) were going to make all those top secret papers open to everyone, which was a massive national security threat.
democrats who worked to help communist USSR in the 1980s targeted Ollie North because North was successful in stopping the communist spread of nukes via Cuba
August 21st, 2008 at 4:15 pm
God, the Republican just HAVE to have someone to fight, don’t they. Bradley, you’re sounding EXACTLY like the KGB.
Oddly enough, the Republicans want to build an Iron Curtain around the U.S.
The government financially is supporting corporations with huge subsidies.
The Republicans just signed off on a HUGE package for farmers, by the way.
The Republican White House has promoted and subsidized propoganda, and squelched free speech (go publish a picture of flag-draped coffins, if you don’t believe me).
Anything but complete lock-step ideology with the Neocons is considered suspicious (microchips, Bradley?).
The government now has freedom to spy on its U.S. citizens and has suspended habeas corpus.
–Dude, don’t you see? Bush is turning us INTO the USSR, pre-Gorbachev.
August 21st, 2008 at 5:21 pm
Now attacking our patriotism isn’t enough, now the left all need to join the military so the cowardly right don’t have to start a draft. Fuck you, fucking cons and your infantile, bullshit arguments. Your time is almost up. 3 Months and the Repubes will be nothing but a small minority with no power to stop the Dems. Not even a filibuster. Not after you lose your Senate seats. Cowards, all of you. Trying to turn Americans against themselves…
August 21st, 2008 at 5:34 pm
–Dude, don’t you see? Bush is turning us INTO the USSR, pre-Gorbachev
Right on Sarah…
August 21st, 2008 at 5:35 pm
“Trying to turn Americans against themselves…”
And unfortunately, they’ve done so successfully. Which is the biggest treasonous threat to our country. Divided we fall. Right back at you Furyus.
August 21st, 2008 at 5:40 pm
People play awfully fast and loose with the word “communism” between communism and fascism, in one the government controls business, while in the other, business controls the government.
14 POINTS OF FASCISM
1. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism
From the prominent displays of flags and bunting to the ubiquitous lapel pins, the fervor to show patriotic nationalism, both on the part of the regime itself and of citizens caught up in its frenzy, was always obvious. Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia.
2. Disdain for the importance of human rights
The regimes themselves viewed human rights as of little value and a hindrance to realizing the objectives of the ruling elite. Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.
3. Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause
The most significant common thread among these regimes was the use of scapegoating as a means to divert the people’s attention from other problems, to shift blame for failures, and to channel frustration in controlled directions. The methods of choice—relentless propaganda and disinformation—were usually effective. Often the regimes would incite “spontaneous” acts against the target scapegoats, usually communists, socialists, liberals, Jews, ethnic and racial minorities, traditional national enemies, members of other religions, secularists, homosexuals, and “terrorists.” Active opponents of these regimes were inevitably labeled as terrorists and dealt with accordingly.
4. The supremacy of the military/avid militarism
Ruling elites always identified closely with the military and the industrial infrastructure that supported it. A disproportionate share of national resources was allocated to the military, even when domestic needs were acute. The military was seen as an expression of nationalism, and was used whenever possible to assert national goals, intimidate other nations, and increase the power and prestige of the ruling elite.
5. Rampant sexism
Beyond the simple fact that the political elite and the national culture were male-dominated, these regimes inevitably viewed women as second-class citizens. They were adamantly anti-abortion and also homophobic. These attitudes were usually codified in Draconian laws that enjoyed strong support by the orthodox religion of the country, thus lending the regime cover for its abuses.
6. A controlled mass media
Under some of the regimes, the mass media were under strict direct control and could be relied upon never to stray from the party line. Other regimes exercised more subtle power to ensure media orthodoxy. Methods included the control of licensing and access to resources, economic pressure, appeals to patriotism, and implied threats. The leaders of the mass media were often politically compatible with the power elite. The result was usually success in keeping the general public unaware of the regimes’ excesses.
7. Obsession with national security
Inevitably, a national security apparatus was under direct control of the ruling elite. It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.
8. Religion and ruling elite tied together
Unlike communist regimes, the fascist and protofascist regimes were never proclaimed as godless by their opponents. In fact, most of the regimes attached themselves to the predominant religion of the country and chose to portray themselves as militant defenders of that religion. The fact that the ruling elite’s behavior was incompatible with the precepts of the religion was generally swept under the rug. Propaganda kept up the illusion that the ruling elites were defenders of the faith and opponents of the “godless.” A perception was manufactured that opposing the power elite was tantamount to an attack on religion.
9. Power of corporations protected
Although the personal life of ordinary citizens was under strict control, the ability of large corporations to operate in relative freedom was not compromised. The ruling elite saw the corporate structure as a way to not only ensure military production (in developed states), but also as an additional means of social control. Members of the economic elite were often pampered by the political elite to ensure a continued mutuality of interests, especially in the repression of “have-not” citizens.
10. Power of labor suppressed or eliminated
Since organized labor was seen as the one power center that could challenge the political hegemony of the ruling elite and its corporate allies, it was inevitably crushed or made powerless. The poor formed an underclass, viewed with suspicion or outright contempt. Under some regimes, being poor was considered akin to a vice.
11. Disdain and suppression of intellectuals and the arts
Intellectuals and the inherent freedom of ideas and expression associated with them were anathema to these regimes. Intellectual and academic freedom were considered subversive to national security and the patriotic ideal. Universities were tightly controlled; politically unreliable faculty harassed or eliminated. Unorthodox ideas or expressions of dissent were strongly attacked, silenced, or crushed. To these regimes, art and literature should serve the national interest or they had no right to exist.
12. Obsession with crime and punishment
Most of these regimes maintained Draconian systems of criminal justice with huge prison populations. The police were often glorified and had almost unchecked power, leading to rampant abuse. “Normal” and political crime were often merged into trumped-up criminal charges and sometimes used against political opponents of the regime. Fear, and hatred, of criminals or “traitors” was often promoted among the population as an excuse for more police power.
13. Rampant cronyism and corruption
Those in business circles and close to the power elite often used their position to enrich themselves. This corruption worked both ways; the power elite would receive financial gifts and property from the economic elite, who in turn would gain the benefit of government favoritism. Members of the power elite were in a position to obtain vast wealth from other sources as well: for example, by stealing national resources. With the national security apparatus under control and the media muzzled, this corruption was largely unconstrained and not well understood by the general population.
14. Fraudulent elections
Elections in the form of plebiscites or public opinion polls were usually bogus. When actual elections with candidates were held, they would usually be perverted by the power elite to get the desired result. Common methods included maintaining control of the election machinery, intimidating and disenfranchising opposition voters, destroying or disallowing legal votes, and, as a last resort, turning to a judiciary beholden to the power elite.
NOTE: The above 14 Points was written in 2004 by Dr. Laurence Britt, a political scientist. Dr. Britt studied the fascist regimes of: Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia), and Pinochet (Chile).
August 21st, 2008 at 7:01 pm
Sarah, “Anything but complete lock-step ideology with the Neocons is considered suspicious (microchips, Bradley?).
The government now has freedom to spy on its U.S. citizens and has suspended habeas corpus.
–Dude, don’t you see? Bush is turning us INTO the USSR, pre-Gorbachev.
”
no! its not that you or everyone must march in lockstep, no one will force you to think as conservatives do; we will seek to find out why you resist and change that, and everyone will be in agreement, thats a fair solution to both sides.
No KGB, if you or any other liberal is law abiding? then there is nothing to worry about.
The nonsense of saying “you have the body” has been suspended? No, that was Lincoln over 100 years ago… enemy combatants dont have full rights, nor should they. No other nation comes close to giving them such good and fair treatment, why dont you complain about their abuse by others? why? because you just want to blame America first!
Its as if you libs are saying “Im sorry for being an American! you terrorists can have our nation, we will give up without any fight!”
yes, having microchips embedded in certain people is a safe and proven system, it sounds like science fiction or some big scheme? no, take away the misconceptions and just consider it, having the chip will save the USA alot of expense in identifying individuals and knowing with certainty specific information, in realtime. Agents who would have to get this info manually can now be doing other things.
So many young people today enjoy body piercings, soon by making the chip able to download mp3 or whatever, they will become viable and ‘cool’, and be popular because of the shock value. A couple movies will be made showing having the chip as being cool, different and modern? one of the cola manufacturers pushing them? they will be sold out fast. with careful marketing the chip will be seen as safe.
The older generations will absolutely continue to hate the chip, making it even more appealing to younger generations.
I hope that in 10 years or so widespread use of the chip will be common
August 22nd, 2008 at 1:51 am
I think it’s a good idea about having a draft to find osama bin laden and to fight all the wars all these blood thirsty, gun loving freaks are itching for. I would also suggest war monger Mcshame, George Bush and all their friends volunteer to be on the front lines. Then we’ll really know how brave these loud,big mouthed so called warriors really are. Put up or shut up. I’m tired of you bullies spouting off and stinking up this whole world with your lies and b.s. Don’t you morons have anything better to do?
August 22nd, 2008 at 2:50 am
Angie, ” Put up or shut up. I’m tired of you bullies spouting off and stinking up this whole world with your lies and b.s. Don’t you morons have anything better to do?
”
many people think this same thing, but please, here is $25, buy a clue!
you want to call Bush, McCain, Cheney and others “Bullies” for wanting war?
Its your right to say that, but how IGNORANT CAN YOU BE???????? come on!
The Bush/McCain/Bradley mindset of wanting to use military force is correct, moral, proper and defends people who should be defended.
If youve got such moral outrage why are you NOT, repeat NOT blaming the people who CAUSE the violence and wars? instead of the people who take actions to stop the real criminals??
Your attitude is one that rewards terrorists and murderers! why are you doing this? how can you be so cruel and heartless to innocent people??
August 22nd, 2008 at 3:02 am
I see no evidence that today’s conservatives have anything but contempt for the United States of America.
To them patriotism is wearing a cheap made in China flag pin and professing blind obedience to a rich and powerful leader.
For liberals, patriotism seems to be more in the commitment to rule by We the People.
As for; “The Bush/McCain/Bradley mindset of wanting to use military force is correct, moral, proper and defends people who should be defended.
THAT utterly depends upon your belief that they are not lying to you.
When their own personal fortunes are tied up in the very foreign policy they make, and they ALREADY have a poor record of dealing with other nations honestly, AND we know their stated plans from the PNAC, the evidence is pretty slim that they are using our treasury and military for anything other than to plunder the resources of another country.
It is the duty of the citizen to be responsible for those they give such great power to, just as the parent is responsible for the pernicious behavior of their own child.
You don’t expect the parent of a rotten kid to say, “That kid over there did something even worse, so my kid gets a free pass!”
As for; “If youve got such moral outrage why are you NOT, repeat NOT blaming the people who CAUSE the violence and wars? instead of the people who take actions to stop the real criminals??
Your attitude is one that rewards terrorists and murderers! why are you doing this? how can you be so cruel and heartless to innocent people??”
How does dropping bombs on innocent people, and destroying their infrastructure hurt the actual terrorists and murderers?
The Reagan/Bush administration CREATED them with help from their good friends the Saudis.
They made a lot of money arming Sadaam and the Iranians, The Bush boys NEVER met a brutal dictator they didn’t love (until they stop cooperating with their business interests)!
So, I’m sorry, but YOUR “attitude is one that rewards terrorists and murderers!”
“How can YOU be so cruel and heartless to innocent people??”
( And so irresponsible as to be such a good German??)
“Whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship…Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger.”
Hermann Goering
August 22nd, 2008 at 8:43 am
quote: “Whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship…Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger.”
Hermann Goering ”
yes I agree with this, its a true ism. so?
OL, you wrote: “How does dropping bombs on innocent people, and destroying their infrastructure hurt the actual terrorists and murderers?”
When has this ever happened? just about every war except* the war in Irak, yet you liberals try to portray Irak as unfair because you loved Saddam so much?
bold faced liars who give speeches about how GW Bush and staff bombed innocents in Irak? its a bunch of lies designed to get YOU all stirred up and organize YOU liberals around a cause based on LIES because they cannot rally your support based on the facts
how you could examine the facts around the Irak war, and conclude the USA and our Allies acted incorrectly is simply bizzare or it says a person would be on the side of the terrorists.
how can you libs be against the Irak war??????? of any war out there this one you should be in full support of.
Im really trying to understand this, even since 2002 I have not found the reason liberals democrats and peaceniks have opposed the Irak war
the obvious thing is the libs want to PRETEND its a bad war so they can use it for political gain, even though its antiAmerican to spit in the face of the troops as the left has been doing;
but then I come across friends or relatives Ive known and know they are otherwise normal but they share this idiotic misinformation point of view. I know they are not paid off, I know they are rational, but still they follow the idiotic mantra of how unfair the Irak war is.
I dont understand why. so when people here or in other places say the same thing it remains a mystery, WHY???
none of the liberal/dem friends/family can take the argument of its an unfair or illegal war and step thru the rationale. they cannot do it, it derails into some irrational hatred of Bush/Cheney and then the misinformation comes out and then its an argument of you must believe the liberal POV misinformation, or youre a fascist scum and not worth talking to.
So while libs may believe it there is no intellectually honest way to make the case.
When the claim is made how innocent civilians were bombed? that claim came from al jazeera and is a bunch of lies. trace back the source of the anti America claims of this Irak war? the source is al jazeera or similar pro terrorist groups who spread misinformation.
Im very suprised and shocked that liberals who should be Americans first, would accept that misinformation as solid fact and ignore all the facts from the sitting US president, and call him a liar, when in fact GW Bush never lied, never misled since being President
Im not trying to argue just to argue, thats a waste of time. And most conservative blogs/forums will delete any discussion that isnt conservative only or gets confrontational, and that in my book is cowardly on the part of conservatives.
So Im here trying to understand why liberals are opposed to the Irak war, maybe somewhere something will be explained to me to help me understand. so would you please help me? liberals are supposed to be compassionate. I yield back the balance of my time.
August 22nd, 2008 at 4:17 pm