If You’re Afraid Of The Press How Do You Handle Ahmadinejad?
McCain’s campaign continues to shield Governor Sarah Palin from the press. First they were going to allow a pool camera and a producer to accompany Palin into five meetings at the UN. At the last minute, that was rescinded, and only cameras, with no producers or reporters was allowed. But the networks wouldn’t play ball, and so the campaign relented, a little, and a CNN producer was allowed into the beginning of the first meeting of the day, with Afghan president Hamid Karzai.
The campaign has cautiously shielded Palin from reporters, allowing just a few interviews and preventing reporters traveling with the campaign from asking questions. She has not held a press conference since being chosen by McCain four weeks ago, and has not done the traditional local interviews when traveling into media markets.
So, just what are the McCain people “cautiously shielding” her from? Those evil meanies in the liberal press who hate America?
Doesn’t matter.
Obama’s gonna win.
September 23rd, 2008 at 3:50 pm
Obviously they’re afraid of the harm she could do, such as in the minds of the moderate independent middle, because being the mayor of Podunk leaves one a little short on seasoning.
September 23rd, 2008 at 3:58 pm
McCain-Palin, easy win in November. Palin is being shielded from the media while she studies up on all of McCain’s positions and gets attuned more towards national politics versus state politics. Is that a horrible thing, especially after the Gibson pompous (or at least pompous-appearing, I actually like Charles Gibson) interview?
So you’d rather have Obama, who has little experience except the “national” and “international” experience that he’s gained WHILST running campaigns versus a governor and former mayor? The idea that Obama is qualified because he’s passed a couple of small pieces of legislation (as you keep touting) is crazy. I’d say Palin is arguably much more qualified to be at the TOP of the ticket than Obama is.
By the way, Alan, you ain’t fit to lay at the heels of Sarah Palin’s high-heeled moose boots! Actually, I wish Palin would come on H&C. You’d be hard but would treat her fairly. Or your radio show…that’d be interesting FER SURE!
September 23rd, 2008 at 4:24 pm
Rocky,
Rottweiler seems a little intimidating when actually “PUG” seems more appropriate, don’t you think?
September 23rd, 2008 at 4:46 pm
I am an independent, I don’t thing any one knows who will win, but I have Great hope that McCain will win. We will see!
September 23rd, 2008 at 4:50 pm
Rocky,
The mayor of Podunk? did you forget she got a promotion?
September 23rd, 2008 at 4:59 pm
Regardless of whether you like or dislike Palin, or whether she has or doesn’t have the experience to be a VP candidate, do you agree that the situation is odd? When was the last time you remember a candidate running for anything–president, vice president, mayor, city council–that was “shielded” from the media and didn’t accept questions from his/her constituents and potential voters?
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:12 pm
Rick,
I find it odd that Obama and his wife have a list of topics they will not discuss (they did this when they were on the view, I don’t know if they do this everytime they have an interview).
In a way I can see her apprehension. She has been constantly dogged by the media, and that is something I have NEVER seen before.
Is she not accepting questions when they have their “town hall” type gatherings?
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:17 pm
Do we do censored interviews like Michelle likes?
Do we go to media that will selectively edit certain things out?
Which way would you have her do an interview?
She saw Charley and Sean. What more do you want?
Personally, they should let her go and watch the polls fly for McCain/Palin. Supressing her is a mistake while letting Biden go talking is a bigger one.
Did you hear Biden today? He thinks TV was developed in 1929 when FDR was president (Clue- It was Hoover) The answers inserted for all the libs who don’t remember basic U.S. history.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:31 pm
Dear Mr. Al Sharpton,
If you are a christian leader, and truly wish to eliminate racism in America, first try forgiving the country of it’s past sins instead of holding it for ransom. No? I didn’t think so. If you gave up promoting racism, you’d have to find a real job.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:32 pm
“I find it odd that Obama and his wife have a list of topics they will not discuss (they did this when they were on the view, I don’t know if they do this everytime they have an interview). In a way I can see her apprehension. She has been constantly dogged by the media, and that is something I have NEVER seen before. Is she not accepting questions when they have their “town hall” type gatherings?”
Fair enough, point taken. I guess my position is the old addage that no publicity is bad publicity. Let her talk in front of cameras. It seems to me the conservative base eats up every word she says and energizes the party. Why can’t she answer a few questions when she stops for ice cream in Orlando? From what I’ve seen, people would love it. I obviously don’t agree with her on many things, but I find it odd that the Republican party would choose to keep her from her voters when they value her charisma.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:39 pm
WHO IS AHMADINEJAD
http://www.amilimani.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=79&Itemid=2
To understand Ahmadinejad’s mind set and behavior requires a close scrutiny of the elaborate and intricate theology of Hujjatiyyah Shiism, perhaps the most fundamentalist of the numerous Shiite sects.
In the 1950s, a group of Islamic clergy led by Sheikh Mahmoud Halabi (a close associate of Ayatollah Khomeini) formed a society called the Anjoman-e Khayryyehye Hujjatiyyah-ye Mahdaviat (Charitable Society of the Mahdi), based in Mashhad, Iran. The Hujjatiyyah membership was mostly composed by the bazaar-i businessmen and fanatical mullahs. Among many things, they were against the communists, Marxists, and atheists. Their overarching “raison d’être,” however, was to prepare the world for the upcoming of the 12th Imam — the Mahdi.
However, the most important immediate agenda item on their list was to harass and persecute the Baha’is, a religious group representing a small percentage of Iran’s population. In fact, the Hujjatiyyah-y’s alternative name became “The anti-Baha’i Society” (Anjuman-e Zidd-e Baha’iyat). They collectively worked for a single purpose: the eradication of Baha’is.
The terrible plight of the Baha’is in Iran is particularly heart-wrenching, since they are the largest non-Muslim population in the country and have been, from day one, severely brutalized by Muslims. Baha’i teachings of tolerance and openness to science are anathema to the Islamofascists on many levels, but the history of the faith includes direct challenges to the theological legitimacy of the mullahs. These slaveholders find the Baha’i faith a threat to their own version of Islam and the absolute theocratic power it puts their hands.
The egomaniac President Ahmadinejad is a member of Hujjatiyyah. He sees himself as the personal vassal of the Mahdi-Messiah or Hidden Imam, with whom he has fantasized tête-à-têtes frequently.
Ahmadinejad, a man driven by his religion, has a spiritual advisor in Ayatollah Mohammad Taghi Mesbah-Yazdi (the defacto leader of the Hujjatiyyah). The President’s advisor is known for his extremist views on Islam and promotes suicide bombings and attacks on civilians in the West. There is only view of Islam for him. He once said, “…if anyone tells you their own interpretation of Islam, punch them in the mouth!”
President Ahmadinejad has in a short time acquired great many descriptors at home and overseas: zealot, fascist, fanatic, anti-Semitic, lunatic and more. One prominent Western columnist called him “unhinged.” But we cannot just dismiss the man as an aberration, someone who is in urgent need of psychological help, a person out of touch with reality, who represents nothing of substance.
Once again the West is misreading and misjudging people and events in the Middle East, due to the fact that it views things through its own prism.
Looking at the man through Western spectacles, he indeed appears to be all of the above and more. Yet Ahmadinejad is far from unhinged. As a matter of fact he is firmly hinged to a set of beliefs that dictate his views of the world, and inform him how he should deal with it from his position of power.
An unhinged man has the potential of becoming once again hinged. But, there is very little that can be done to a person who is inseparably hinged, and Ahmadinejad views are firmly rooted in the most orthodox philosophy of Shiism.
For our purposes, however, it is sufficient to document the fact that Ahmadinejad is not mentally disturbed; there is no display of contradictory thoughts and behavior. There is a full internal consistency in Ahmadinejad. Ahmadinejad’s words, deeds and beliefs show a fully hinged person.
Below are a few examples of his sayings, beliefs and actions. Whether one agrees or disagrees with them, they all fit perfectly into a consistent pattern.
▪ He literally believes in the imminent emergence of the Mahdi – the Shiites’ promised one who is expected to appear to set aright a decadent and wretched world.
▪ He views himself as the vassal of Mahdi, working for him and being accountable to him.
▪ His main task is to prepare the world so to hasten the Mahdi’s coming. If this preparation requires much destruction and bloodshed, so be it.
▪ As a former mayor of Tehran, he developed elaborate detailed plans preparing the city for the arrival of the Mahdi.
▪ He allocated generous sums for extensive road improvement to a mosque at Jamkaaraan near the city of Qum where it is believed the promised Mahdi is hiding in a well since the age of four, over 1100 years ago.
▪ He reportedly visits the well frequently and drops his written supplications into the well for the hidden Mahdi to act upon them.
▪ He has said in private that it was he who asked the Mahdi to inflict the massive stroke on Ariel Sharon.
▪ He sees the Jews as the sworn enemies of Islam. The hostility dates back to the time of Muhammad’s own treatment of the Jews in Medina. At first, expediently, Muhammad called the Jews “people of the book,” and accorded them a measure of tolerance until he gained enough power to unleash his devastating wrath on them.
▪ He says that the Holocaust is a myth. He is, in this respect, in good company with a number of other revisionist fanatics.
▪ He wants Israel to be wiped out of the map or transferred to Europe.
▪ In his speech at the UN general assembly, he implored the Mahdi to come and save the world. He claimed that during his speech of some twenty odd minutes, a powerful light enveloped him and all participants were held transfixed, unable to move their eyes.
▪ He believes that the earth is Allah’s and all people must either become believers of his brand of Islam or must perish as infidels najis (unclean) who by their very presence defile Allah’s earth.
▪ He believes that this earthly life is passing and worthless in comparison to the afterlife awaiting a devoted and faithful believer. Hence, he holds to the old belief that if a faithful kills an infidel, he goes to Allah’s paradise; and, if the faithful gets killed in the process of serving the faith, again he goes to Allah’s paradise. Hence, it is a win-win proposition for the faithful.
Ahmadinejad is a true devoted Muslim. Being unpredictable, self-contradictory and inconsistent are major symptoms of the mentally unhinged. By these standards of insanity, Ahmadinejad emerges as completely sane. He is fully predictable, consistent and has shown no self-contradiction. He does not even pretend that he misspoke or apologize for his outrageous statements. He is not a typical politician who practices the devious art of doublespeak, deception and change of position to suit his immediate convenience.
He knows who he is, what he believes, and what his own mission in life is: serving as the instrument for the revered Mahdi. Allah will make him emerge from the well as soon as the world’s conditions hit absolute hopeless bottom. Ahmadinejad sees himself as a driver who can play a critical role in doing just that, driving the world to the very bottom. And he plans on having an arsenal of nuclear weapons as soon as possible.
There is nothing really “unhinged” about Ahamadinejad’s thinking, statements and actions. They are internally consistent. He is simply a fanatic who is wedded to an extremely dangerous exclusionary system of belief. Humanity must learn that dismissing him as a lunatic will result in great suffering, as it did with Hitler.
Tragically, Ahmadinejad is the embodiment of several million people who are hinged exactly like him and who are willing to give their lives, and take with them as many lives as required in the service of their belief. In this age of Weapons of Mass Destruction a man with huge sums of petrodollars can serve as the catalyst of total annihilation.
Prudence would err on the side of being an alarmist than a complacent dismissive.
Ahmadinejad and his ilk are not interested in any negotiation, any compromise or any live-and-let-live final solution. They are determined to be the soldiers of Mahdi come-what-may. They have no problem with the total destruction of the world. They are headed for a life of eternal bliss in Allah’s paradise. They hardly care, even rejoice, if the rest of humanity is subjected to a tragic death in the nuclear, biological and chemical wasteland of planet earth.
Humanity cannot afford and must not ignore the emergence of the final threat to its very existence on this planet.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:42 pm
Crazy Conservative,
You Do have :
Former Cheney communications director, Cathie Martin testified that;
“I suggested we put the vice president on ‘Meet the Press,’ which was a tactic we often used,” Martin testified. “It’s our best format.”
She wrote,
Option 1: “MTP-VP,” then listed the pros and cons of a vice presidential appearance on the Sunday show. Under “pro,” she wrote: “control message.”
Katie Couric editing McCain’s mistakes.
By Howard Kurtz and Michael D. Shear
When CBS’s Katie Couric interviewed John McCain on Tuesday, her producers edited one exchange to include part of McCain’s answer to a previous question on Iraq — and, in the process, deleted comments that have touched off a controversy.
The “CBS Evening News” interview began with Couric quoting Barack Obama as saying that “there might have been improved security even without the surge. What’s your response to that?”
But what viewers saw next was not what the Arizona senator said next, an out-of-order sequence that news organizations generally do not allow.
You say;
“Which way would you have her do an interview?
She saw Charley and Sean. What more do you want?”
We want her to do REAL press conferences where different reporters ask any questions they want.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Based on the above, Sarah is much more appropriate to deal with A’jad than Obama.
September 23rd, 2008 at 5:49 pm
Hi, T: “In a way I can see her apprehension. She has been constantly dogged by the media, and that is something I have NEVER seen before.”
Perhaps the reason she’s been dogged by the media (dogged in two ways, really) is precisely because she’s obviously not up to interviews. She’s dogged/hounded by the media because they’re desperately looking for information they can tell US about her views, experience, etc., and she’s dogged/pounded by blogs, commentaries, and editorial pages because she’s being so secretive.
“Is she not accepting questions when they have their “town hall” type gatherings?”
She probably will, but the “town hall” meetings that Bush pioneered were scripted, and the audience vetted, so that it was slanted in the candidate’s favor.
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:00 pm
[...] Has the “Straight Talk Express” become the “No Talk Express“? Alan exposes the Republican plan to protect McCain & Palin from media [...]
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:00 pm
Vince P,
Liberals would rather see Abdinejhad greeted with a kiss kiss, than risk him being bitten by a “pit bull”. They wouldn’t want to ruffle the “chickens” feathers. Its a liberal fear of Muslims which they’ll not admit to, but it’s there.
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:09 pm
How dare this Palin person refuse to speak to our media attack dogs. We need to force down the shield of protection so that we may grill her mercilessly on important topics like why her daughter chose to carry her fetus to term, who is really the mother of her daughter’s boyfriend, and how she will enjoy returnign to the weather spot on the local newscast when she fails in this VP bid and finishes her term as Mayor of Mooseville. It matters not what she will say, for we can find fault and criticize everything she says, has said, or will say! The neocons should realize that there is nothing they can do to stop the impending hope for our country. Our leaders promise to bring the honest and respected politics of southside Chicago to Washington. Real change we can all believe in.
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:19 pm
“She’s dogged/hounded by the media because they’re desperately looking for information they can tell US about her views, experience, etc., and she’s dogged/pounded by blogs, commentaries, and editorial pages because she’s being so secretive.”
Good point. If she doesn’t work to make news, the news has to work to make her. Lately, Biden has said many good things, a few bonehead things, but he’s doing a much better job controlling the flow of information. This “Palin vs. the Media” thing is hanging on because she has done nothing to bring any new bits to starving journalists. A few comments about what she talked about with world leaders and that would be the story; the mainstream media will move on.
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:20 pm
You know it’s bad when even Fox is complaining:
FOX News Producer Shushannah Walshe just lashed out at the McCain campaign for denying access to reporters who wanted to witness Sarah Palin’s U.N. photo ops earlier today. Walshe said the McCain campaign’s restrictions on press coverage were “just unprecedented.”
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:39 pm
Dear Alan
Press are not evel. May be McCane do not want press because, may be Sarah do not want Media Circus. May be she want to learn. Beside, she is not USA vice. Everything Sarah will say it will be a laughing issue in S&L etc. It will be like “Bush doctorine.” Hollywood and CBS,NBC,ABC are anti Gov. Sarah Palin.She is not “their gal.” It is not Hillary Clinton.
I also believe that Afganishan, Pakisthan,India are very different. India and Pakisthan hate each other. Same as Iran and Israil. Afganishan and Pakisthan border are terrorist unclave. Even the Pakisthani and Afgani goverments stay away from it. Kurds hate every one but themselves.
Russia is another ball game. They are the permanent member of “Security council” They can veto anything. UN can not do anything for Georgia attack by Russia.
UN’s genaral Assembly meeting is super complicated.You are talking about the “World is under one roof in NYC.” Gov. Sarah palin will learn so much. UN is beyond “My cuntry vs their country.”
September 23rd, 2008 at 6:51 pm
Press, as in a body of journalists with integrity?
Haven’t seen any of them this year, sorry.
September 23rd, 2008 at 7:02 pm
“Press, as in a body of journalists with integrity?
Haven’t seen any of them this year, sorry.”
Even the respected conservative George Will has turned against McCain this year.
September 23rd, 2008 at 7:23 pm
Old,
The press no longer has the trust of the conservative population…the editing on the President is conclusive of that. NBC, ABC and CBS can’t do a fair job. I don’t think she needs to do that.
September 23rd, 2008 at 7:30 pm
“Rottweiler seems a little intimidating when actually “PUG” seems more appropriate, don’t you think?”
I’m not a neoCon so I can do things other than snarl.
“The mayor of Podunk? did you forget she got a promotion?”
It’s a little like going from mayor of Podunk to county commissioner. You could call it a promotion, but it’s not like she starred on Broadway.
“Sarah is much more appropriate to deal with A’jad than Obama.”
Well obviously she’d just love to be the first woman to launch a nuclear first strike, which, if she’s in a bunker somewhere, might end with her being the last woman alive on earth.
September 23rd, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Vince,
RE: Ahmadinejad
Another area we agree on is that he is bad news – worse than an unpredictable nut, he is an entirely predictable nut.
However, what do you propose we do about Iran? Do you favor dealing with them militarily directly, militarily through proxy (Israel), or what?
Honestly, I think eventually we may very well end up dealing with them militarily, however I feel we need to talk to them first. There is a small chance that diplomacy could work (only because there is a slim chance that the Iranian people could put enough pressure on the Iranian leadership to act in a sane manner). The more likely benefit of diplomacy, however, is the possibility of getting a more partners to help us with Iran.
I do not feel we should have to act unilaterally on Iran, however if we do not give other countries the cover of having attempted diplomacy first – it’s going to be us and Israel vs. Iran, and it just doesn’t have to be. We could have our friends help us on this one.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:00 pm
“However, what do you propose we do about Iran? Do you favor dealing with them militarily directly, militarily through proxy (Israel), or what?”
Destroy its gasoline refinery (it only has one or two) and embargo all fuel shipments.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:07 pm
It’s probably too late now. I think the window of avoiding nuclear attack by Iran on the US is over and it’s just a matter of time.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:08 pm
“Even the respected conservative George Will has turned against McCain this year.”
Since when have conservatives been supportive of John McCain? John McCain has been loathed by many conservatives for years… if Obama wasn’t a Marxist, McCain would have little support right now.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:10 pm
Crazy Conservative,
That is EXACTLY what liberals have been saying, pretty much since the networks and cable decided that their MAIN job was to entertain instead of inform.
I’ve said this before, but I have NOT seen TV news since Sept. 2004, although I do see clips on the net.
I remember in the 60s, the show Firing Line, where you could see debates between William F Buckely and Noam Chomsky, and they would each ACTUALLY be quite while the other one spoke….and NO moving pictures or shiney objects.
But that was in a bygone time.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:15 pm
Michelle is not the appropriate comparison to Palin. Michelle has been stumping on the campaign trail nearly 2 years and has given several interviews despite not running for any elective office herself. The woman has been villified in the media, had her image caricatured in ugly ways, and had many unflattering things are said about her even though she is smart, fit, educated, and a devoted wife and mother. She’s given WAY more interviews than Palin ever has.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:41 pm
Sepia,
I hope you aren’t saying that Governor Palin has not been villified, had her image caricatured in ugly ways, and had many unflattering things said and written about her.
Governor Palin is also smart, fit, educated, and a devoted wife and mother.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:53 pm
Oh Vince,
Iran will strike Isreal. They will be more than likely to do it, if Obama does get in. They know there will be no action by him and he won’t use military at all. Just his lovely sermons uh…speechs. The first one will be called “Don’t do that”
But you can’t call say this because it’s called fear mongering….I call it the future reality.
September 23rd, 2008 at 8:59 pm
You know talking to terrorists worked for Carter. Oops, no it didn’t. When are people going to figure out that you can’t reason with leaders of terrorist nations?
The Iranian President kills women who are raped, kills children and doesn’t blink an eye. He believes it is his job to usher in the next Messiah.
Oddly enough, his rhetoric today at the UN sounded a lot like some other people in recent news. He basically said that the Americans were getting what they deserved on the economic front because of how wicked we are, and how we treat the world. Sounds like Jeremiah Wright.
Obama wants to “talk” to him (the leader of Iran) while he nukes our allies. He doesn’t want to militarize space or continue with our nuclear weapons program. He said earlier in his campaign that he wanted to talk to Russia. I don’t think Russia wants to talk anymore.
Oh well, Iran is just a “small” nation we don’t need to worry about.
September 23rd, 2008 at 9:13 pm
@Flap
Where have you been!?
McCain-Palin, easy win in November.
I think it’s foolish for either side to take this election for granted when every poll out there has this at a dead heat and so many toss up states out there.
Palin is being shielded from the media while she studies up on all of McCain’s positions and gets attuned more towards national politics versus state politics. Is that a horrible thing, especially after the Gibson pompous (or at least pompous-appearing, I actually like Charles Gibson) interview?
Oh, give me a break! Somehow every other candidate finds the time to talk to the media! We’ve only really known Sarah Palin for a month and we still don’t know all that much about her! They’re shielding her from the media because they don’t want her to screw up and give the “wrong” answer to tough questions and so that they can “energize the base” by whining about the “liberal media”.
So you’d rather have Obama, who has little experience except the “national” and “international” experience that he’s gained WHILST running campaigns versus a governor and former mayor? The idea that Obama is qualified because he’s passed a couple of small pieces of legislation (as you keep touting) is crazy. I’d say Palin is arguably much more qualified to be at the TOP of the ticket than Obama is.
To quote Jay Diamond, “I don’t want somebody who’s experienced in being a right-wing extremist.”
And, yes, Obama is MUCH more qualified than Palin is. Palin represented 7,000 people in Wasilla. Obama, as one of 59 members of the Illinois Senate, represented over 217,000 people. Obama’s work as a community organizer on the South Side of Chicago is probably about as valuable as Palin’s experience as a small town mayor was.
Please don’t give me this BS about small town mayors having “actual responsibilities” and community organizers not. It’s sickening to hear the Republicans ridicule people for serve their communities. In Barack’s case, he could have made plenty of money elsewhere, but he wanted to serve something larger than himself. Something that John McCain himself has talked a lot about and demonstrated through his military service, which makes Palin’s rhetoric all the more baffling.
By the way, Alan, you ain’t fit to lay at the heels of Sarah Palin’s high-heeled moose boots! Actually, I wish Palin would come on H&C. You’d be hard but would treat her fairly. Or your radio show…that’d be interesting FER SURE!
She only wants to talk to people like Sean and Rush. The woman won’t even do Larry King! I seriously doubt that she’s going to talk to Alan, but we’ll wait and see.
September 23rd, 2008 at 9:30 pm
Michelle is not the appropriate comparison to Palin. Michelle has been stumping on the campaign trail nearly 2 years and has given several interviews despite not running for any elective office herself. The woman has been villified in the media, had her image caricatured in ugly ways, and had many unflattering things are said about her even though she is smart, fit, educated, and a devoted wife and mother. She’s given WAY more interviews than Palin ever has.
What liberal media?
September 23rd, 2008 at 9:32 pm
Palin not talking to the press?
She doesn’t talk to anybody…she screeches!
Maybe McCain realizes that she’d steal his limelight in a heartbeat. After all, he is the presidential cnadidate not her, but you’d hardly know it from the way she behaves.
September 23rd, 2008 at 9:51 pm
“Oh Vince,
Iran will strike Isreal”
I disagree. I think all their talk about nuking Israel is misdirection.
Iran doens’t need Missiles to nuke Israel. They could it by ground.
Besides, Iran’s govt is religiously motivated and they believe the Caiphate that the Mahdi will reestablish will have it’s capital be in Jerusalem. Iran will not be nuking Israel.
Iran will be nuking the Great Satan however. Iran will use it’s one shot on the biggest target. Iran is not going to waste it’s wad , knowing it will be destroyed in retailation, and not do the most effective thing for world-wide Islam.
September 23rd, 2008 at 10:35 pm
Michael,
I’ve been busy, but I’m glad you remember me!
I have a gut feeling that because of the Palin effect, mixed in with the insecurity about someone relatively new and inexperienced like Obama, AND the “racism” factor that will force certain people not to vote for Obama…all that together will cause McCain/Palin to win. I don’t give a flip that he’s black, but some people do. And that’s sad, admittedly. The poll about 1/3 of Democrats have a negative view of blacks is interesting as well.
I still don’t understand what a community organizer actually does. Doesn’t a mayor and/or governor have to make actual executive decisions that affect people? Community organizers do what?
Obama “represented” people by voting present or passing insignificant legislation? All the while, Palin actually has to make up-or-down decisions on issues likely on a daily basis? And being governor of Alaska…lots and lots of experience, even in the short time she’s been governor.
No, Palin, doesn’t have *loads* of experience, but she 1) has much more substantive, decision-making executive leadership experience than Obama and 2) has enough to be a VP candidate.
September 23rd, 2008 at 10:40 pm
Why should Sarah Palin give the press the time of day after the way they have treated her? She will handle Ahmadinejad just fine, kind of like she has handled the press so far. They are not her match. She is more competent to be Vice President and President than Charlie Gibson is to be the anchor of ABC Nightly News.
September 23rd, 2008 at 10:53 pm
Vince.
I hope your correct
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:16 pm
Crazy,
I know you are crazy, but Vince’s last post said that he thinks Iran will not nuke Israel, but will nuke the U.S. instead.
And you hope he is correct.
Vince, that is what you said, right? Or am I the one who is crazy.
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:21 pm
Vinny , you got a crystal ball to see these events?
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:32 pm
Vinny, I suspect you are uninformed. Iran has at least seven refineries and should be import free on gas by 2010.
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:42 pm
“Vinny , you got a crystal ball to see these events? Posted by jeffro September 23rd, 2008 at 11:32 pm”
Hmmm. very smart question. I’ll let you think about it some more before I answer.
“Vinny, I suspect you are uninformed. Iran has at least seven refineries and should be import free on gas by 2010. Posted by jeffro September 23rd, 2008 at 11:42 pm”
My info is as old as the time Iran took the UK Sailors hostage and dressed them up like Dr Evil for a week. If they built new refineraries since then , then that’s new.
“I know you are crazy, but Vince’s last post said that he thinks Iran will not nuke Israel, but will nuke the U.S. instead. And you hope he is correct. Vince, that is what you said, right? Or am I the one who is crazy. Posted by Um Cara September 23rd, 2008 at 11:21 pm”
Yes that is what I said. Why would Iran go through all this effort to build a massive nuclear program and missile program to destroy a country that is infinitismally small? How many nukes does it take to destroy Israel? They could have just bought two warheads from North Korea and saved themselves all this expense and risk.
Iran understands that if it were to nuke Israel, that some country would respond and nuke it back. Since Iran’s hatred of Israel is entirely religious based yuo have to ask yourself..what threatens its religious agenda the most? Little Israel? No. The Great Satan stands in the way of Caliphate.
It’s the Great Satan that defends the pagan international world system. Allah demands Sharia to rule the world. Man-made law is idolitry in Islam.
Their WMDs are for us.
Why do you think they are making alliances with Leftist Central and South American countries?
What do you think Hezbellah has been doing in Central and South America for the past decade?
And Iran has made the following statements since A’jad been elected in 05.
1
Commandant of Iran’s elite Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps, Major General Yahya Rahim Safavi, said on state television. “God willing, the 21st century will see the defeat of the U.S. and the Zionists, and the victory of freedom-seeking nations of the world. The final goal of the [1979] revolution is to create global Islamic rule and a regime of law to be led by the Imam Mahdi”.
2
The [Iranians] President’s chief strategist, Hassan Abbassi, has come up with a war plan based on the premise that “Britain is the mother of all evils” – the evils being America, Australia, New Zealand, Israel, the Gulf states and even Canada, all of whom are the malign progeny of the British Empire. “We have a strategy drawn up for the destruction of Anglo-Saxon civilization,” says Mr Abbassi. “There are 29 sensitive sites in the U.S. and in the West. We have already spied on these sites and we know how we are going to attack them… Once we have defeated the Anglo-Saxons the rest will run for cover.”
3
The IRGC chief warned that Iran was seeing through “critical days” and “fate-determining years”. He described the purpose of Iran’s 1979 Islamic revolution as the “Salvation of Muslims” from the hands of the “oppressive U.S. and Israel”.
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:53 pm
Vince,
Crazy Conservative may hope you are correct, but I for one hope that Iran does not nuke us.
September 23rd, 2008 at 11:57 pm
Neither do I
September 24th, 2008 at 12:06 am
I know that, Vince.
I also think the people afraid of religion in the U.S. government (and I am one of those people by the way) need to be even more afraid of a country like Iran which *really* has a death cult in charge (as opposed to the false allegation some make that the democratic party is the party of death).
September 24th, 2008 at 12:10 am
Vinny, you sound like a shrill terrified person. Our next president will meet with these leaders to once and for all get to the bottom of what is bothering these people. Sorry, but I don’t take hannity as a source of news about anything, A real leader will show the American people the results of these meetings so We the People can hear for ourselves the exchange. Maybe then we can conclude what we should do. Iran has not attacked any nation in three hundred years! Part of your problem is you have too many perceived “enemies”. This administrations policy is not effective in a “Global economy” it’s much too secretive I must hear it from the horses mouth before i agree with any action that is aggressive. AmJad is NOT the Decider over there. Or didn’t you know that?
September 24th, 2008 at 12:23 am
” Our next president will meet with these leaders to once and for all get to the bottom of what is bothering these people”
Are you deaf.. they say what is bothering them almost every day. They need the Mahdi to come to usher in the world of peace and justice that Allah promised.
Now you may think they don’t mean it.. but that’s your problem. That’s the problem of most Leftists, they do not take other people seriously.
The rest of your comment is full of irrelevent partisan nonsense, that’s another example of you not taking what people say seriously.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:30 am
I take people very seriously. To a fault sometimes. I could just as easily say that YOU want to usher in some fundamentalist end game with your rhetoric. Are you some kind of rapture righty, or dominionist or something? All I ask is for my leaders to present proof in context, of eminent threat before I can go along with any thing this administration does in my name. After all their record is not great as far as being correct on many important decisions. Would you agree with me on that point at least?
September 24th, 2008 at 12:48 am
The Republican Campaign Shielding Palin from the Media reminds me of How The Democratic Campaign Managers have been Shielding Senator Obama from Live Forums and Debates. All that posturing in May about Anytime Anywhere from Obama about debates is just that Posturing. He will only do the 3 mandatory debates agreed to from the beginning. Makes you wonder why they are so afraid of him speaking without a script and a telepromptor. ROFLOL.
September 24th, 2008 at 1:03 am
At first I thought it was off that Alan Didn’t get to ask Sarah Palin any questions. Then I remembered A couple of weeks ago he publicly questioned her judgement during labor and delivery.
Why exactly would she waste her time on him? I don’t think she needs any maternity advice right now.
He’s already blown his chance by using that inane line of logic and questioning, so why should she give him the time of day.
September 24th, 2008 at 1:14 am
>I take people very seriously. To a fault sometimes.
No you don’t. I don’t think you know the first thing about Twelver Shia Islam.
>I could just as easily say that YOU want to usher in some fundamentalist end game with your rhetoric. Are you some kind of rapture righty, or dominionist or something?
I’m not particularly religious and never said that I was. I know a lot about it though.
>All I ask is for my leaders to present proof in context, of eminent threat before I can go along with any thing this administration does in my name.
Eminent threat is too late. Iran should have been taken care of a long time ago.. the cost would have been minimal. now the cost will be horrendous.
>After all their record is not great as far as being correct on many important decisions. Would you agree with me on that point at least?
That’s a constant fact of life.
September 24th, 2008 at 1:16 am
No, just a constant fact of life during Neocon Rule. Never right about any thing they ever told We the People. You didnt know about Irans refining capacity, but I should take your word that now it’s too late for any sensible diplomacy? And by the way, what do you mean by take care of Iran? You dont think that Killing people, that dont have any say in these events (people just like you and I!)Is the thing to do,Do You? How conservative is that? Thats Just more neocon bush doctrine! It doesn’t work! You must be a loyal bushie. You are right. I dont know about some dogma that you cite, but that is for the experts to study. Did you research this islam thingy you talk about, and do you really think you can kill your way to security? I think your just really a paraniod War Monger. IMHO
September 24th, 2008 at 2:03 am
>No, just a constant fact of life during Neocon Rule
And who are the Neocon rulers?
>. You didnt know about Irans refining capacity, but I should take your word that now it’s too late for any sensible diplomacy?
The two have nothing to do with each other.
>And by the way, what do you mean by take care of Iran? You dont think that Killing people, that dont have any say in these events (people just like you and I!)Is the thing to do,Do You?
OMG KILLING PEOPLE!!! *screaming and crying*
I mean destroying its evil government.
Yes people will die. That is the path the mullahs have chosen.
>How conservative is that?
Well national defense never used to be a partisan thing… but since the days the leftists have decided to be Anti-American, I guess it is a Conservative thing now. Shame on you.
>Thats Just more neocon bush doctrine! It doesn’t work! You must be a loyal bushie. You are right.
Such shallow thinking. My position is totally independent of Bush. If Bush and I agreed, Iran wouldn’t be a threat today.
>I dont know about some dogma that you cite, but that is for the experts to study.
No, it’s not. If you’re an American and you give a damn about your country, you would take the time to learn about your enemy because it should inform your vote.
Instead you’ll actively remain ignorant and think everything in the world happens because of something Bush did. Thank God he’s out of office in a few months and you’ll have to come up with a new way to remain ignorant.
>Did you research this islam thingy you talk about
Yes, more than 10 years of learning about insanity.
>and do you really think you can kill your way to security? I think your just really a paraniod War Monger. IMHO
Your opinion is retarderd. Yeah I’m a ‘war monger’..
It’s funny you would probably go to any length to deny that Iran is a war monger, yet you wouldn’t give someone from your own country the same benefit.
September 24th, 2008 at 2:35 am
1.The current occupant and his masters-Cheney,PNAC,Ect. Dont pretend. its obvious diverting. 2. I wasn’t comparing the two. more diverting. You said “eminent threat is too late” How credible is someone that would even type that? As if you know what is or isnt too late! 3.Mocking the killing of civilians? Very telling about you. Evil gov. you say? The same one that has NEVER attacked anyone in three hundred years? The path the mullahs have chosen? Prove It! you wont be able to. “People will die”.Easy for you to say. Again , helps me get a read on you. 4.National Defense IS important! It is not partisan. show me a leftist that says otherwise. I think your credibility is sinking fast now! “… but since the days the leftists have decided to be Anti-American, I guess it is a Conservative thing now. Shame on you” No, Shame on you! To question the War Policy of our leaders is the exact OPPOSITE of Anti- American. Its Patriotic! but you wouldnt know. You’d call Thomas Jefferson a leftist.5.”Such shallow thinking. My position is totally independent of Bush” Classic Projection! Your thinking is exactly like the Bush/Cheney doctrine(also known as the 1% doctrine) but dont ask sarah palin.She didn’t know! Do you even read your own posts? But I’m the shallow thinker! This is becoming funny! 6. I’m an American. I give a Damn about My Country,And I do take lots of time to learn,but Iran is my enemy? Says who? YOU? I think your scared of your own shadow.Go hide under your bed from the scary brown people! 7. If you don’t think lots of things happened in the world because of what bush did then your not only ignorant,I would diagnose you to have a bad case of cognitive dissonance. 7.”Yes, more than 10 years of learning about insanity.” Please cite some of these sources of your learning because im starting to question any credibility in you at all, let alone YOUR sanity.8.”It’s funny you would probably go to any length to deny that Iran is a war monger, yet you wouldn’t give someone from your own country the same benefit.” You do realize with that last incomprehensible statement I am speechless. Stupified i am.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:00 am
Try using some line breaks,,, Christ.. your stuff is hard enough to read as it is.
>1 – The current occupant and his masters-Cheney,PNAC,Ect. Dont pretend. its obvious diverting
George Bush is not a neocon and Cheney has been powerless since the 1st term. Who are the neocon rulers now.. today.
>2. I wasn’t comparing the two. more diverting. You said “eminent threat is too late” How credible is someone that would even type that? As if you know what is or isnt too late!
I have to explain to you what the difference is between that has nuclear weapons and a country that doesn’t?
>3.Mocking the killing of civilians? Very telling about you. Evil gov. you say? The same one that has NEVER attacked anyone in three hundred years? The path the mullahs have chosen? Prove It! you wont be able to. “People will die”.Easy for you to say. Again , helps me get a read on you.
I wasn’t mocking them dying.. I was mocking your misplaced concern about just which people will be dying. As usual it seems you care more about them then you do about Americans.
>4.National Defense IS important! It is not partisan. show me a leftist that says otherwise.
Tell me.. what original defense idea have the Democrats come up with in the past decade? And not from a Commission.
>I think your credibility is sinking fast now!
I’m under no illusion I had any. I know how you folks “think”.
> “… but since the days the leftists have decided to be Anti-American, I guess it is a Conservative thing now. Shame on you” No, Shame on you! To question the War Policy of our leaders is the exact OPPOSITE of Anti- American. Its Patriotic!
It’s patriotic to vote for a war and then after a few kooks were able to get away with bad-mouthing it, the entire Party turns against it, WHILE IT’S STILL GOING ON.
No that isn’t Patriotism. That’s Sedition.
>but you wouldnt know. You’d call Thomas Jefferson a leftist.
Thomas Jefferson fought the Muslim terrorists of his day without a War Declaration because he thought he couldn’t get one yet he knew they had to be fought anyway.. so he went to war with them without one.
Thomas Jefferson is more of a patriot then you’ll ever be
>5.”Such shallow thinking. My position is totally independent of Bush” Classic Projection! Your thinking is exactly like the Bush/Cheney doctrine(also known as the 1% doctrine) but dont ask sarah palin.She didn’t know! Do you even read your own posts? But I’m the shallow thinker! This is becoming funny!
Bush doesn’t follow his own Doctrine and hasn’t since 2003. So why do you persist in saying he adheres to it? Seems your mind is stuck back in 2001.
>6. I’m an American. I give a Damn about My Country,And I do take lots of time to learn,but Iran is my enemy? Says who? YOU? I think your scared of your own shadow.Go hide under your bed from the scary brown people!
They say it. Almost every day. How brainwashed are you?
>7. If you don’t think lots of things happened in the world because of what bush did then your not only ignorant,I would diagnose you to have a bad case of cognitive dissonance.
Iran hated us long before Bush came around. And the Islamists hated us before there was even an Israel. You can blame the US for jihad all you want that’s what they’re counting on.
>7.”Yes, more than 10 years of learning about insanity.” Please cite some of these sources of your learning because im starting to question any credibility in you at all, let alone YOUR sanity.
Why don’t you just quiz me on it.. since you know so much.
>8.”It’s funny you would probably go to any length to deny that Iran is a war monger, yet you wouldn’t give someone from your own country the same benefit.” You do realize with that last incomprehensible statement I am speechless. Stupified i am.
I know you are.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:44 am
Did I mention 52-43? Ahhh, we can all relax now.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:55 am
” I know you are.” You forgot, BUT WHAT AM I?
September 24th, 2008 at 5:57 am
Another couple of numbers that I’m feeling pretty damned happy about… 366-172 (write those ones down!)
September 24th, 2008 at 6:09 am
The wonderful thing is that even if McCain’s mob found out something dreadful about Barack now, they have established themselves as such shameless serial liars, that no-one but the wingbat fringe would believe them!
Oh, I do like those 52-43 numbers :)
September 24th, 2008 at 6:16 am
Vince, If you think Cheney has no power you have to prove it. me thinks you make stuff up. Iran has NO NUCLEAR WEAPONS.”eminent threat is too late” Thats STILL B.S. Show me the war declaration with any democrats name on it. You can’t. The 911 commission recomended many defense ideas after they convened. your guy implemented NONE OF THEM! “No that isn’t Patriotism. That’s Sedition” What’s sedition? Questioning policy is not sedition. you need to Quit lying. I never persisted in saying anything . Just pointed out that you seem to support that insane doctrine. “They say it. Almost every day. How brainwashed are you?” Again, Iran is MY enemy? Prove it. You Can’t. “Iran hated us long before Bush came around. And the Islamists hated us before there was even an Israel. You can blame the US for jihad all you want that’s what they’re counting on.” Show me a source for this drivel you paranoid coward. They dont hate me, They hate the policy that your kind endorses. I won’t quiz you on anything. your a very fearful little man that I wouldnt trust to tell the truth about anything! By the way, They could use you in Iraq. They take almost anybody now you know. You should go sign up and support the cause your so worked up about. What am I saying? Liked you’d ever do somthing patriotic like that.
September 24th, 2008 at 6:48 am
I gave up on that one some time ago, Jeffro. At first glance it looks as though he is reasonably literate, but once you subtract the vast cut’n'pastes, all that’s left is one of those ‘question me and you’re a commie/traitor/islamofascist/America-hater (pick one or more) pre-programmed wingbats.
You can’t change his mind, cos he just doesn’t have one of his own.
September 24th, 2008 at 6:56 am
Jeffro: You’re trying to make the illogical thinking logical. VP obviously has anger management issues and very paranoid thought process. As you also stated I would encourage those who believe in the Iraq war, or any war for that matter, to get PERSONALLY involved, and enlist. Words full of bluster on a web site are one thing, personal involvment another. Or if a person is too old to enlist, volunteer at a hospital,assist the vets you claim to care so much about.
September 24th, 2008 at 9:26 am
Jeffro said of Iran:
They dont hate me, They hate the policy that your kind endorses.
Jeffro, assuming you are not Muslim, the real leadership of Iran does in fact hate you and it has nothing to do with policy. It is an end of world religious thing, and there are a small minority of Christians who are also on board with this type of philosophy.
The average Iranian, or the average Muslim, doesn’t hate you – but these nutjobs running Iran are anything but average. Have a chat with a recent Iranian immigrant some time.
That is why I think dialogue with Iran is a tactical thing, we should do it to get other countries on board with us, but the likelihood of this being resolved through discussion is slim. There is the small possibility that the average Iranian (who does not, by the way, share the view of the leadership of Iran) would overthrow their government, but probably not.
The world is almost certainly well on it’s way to military conflict with Iran, and unfortunately it is a religious thing. I disagree with Vince that the U.S. is necessarily where they will set off their nuke (and guys, it does not have to be a long range missile, or even a particularly advanced device – most would agree they are not too far off from a non missile nuke. They certainly have the makings for a very nasty ‘dirty’ bomb already). France or England are both fat, juicy targets and much more accessible.
September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 am
xzc
September 24th, 2008 at 11:20 am
Iran has hated us ever since we overthrew Mossadegh.
He was a democratically elected leader whom embraced democracy AND American values.
He was elected because he promised to put the wefare of his people above that of Anglo-Iranian Oil,(now British Petroleum), and they wouldn’t have it
He had to be overthrown and replaced by the Shaw and his brutal secret police, Savak.
The resentment festered, and festered, for 25 years, till they could overthrow him.
Now look what we’ve got.
Overthrowing popular leaders for the sake of foreign corporations, ALWAYS ends badly for us.
September 24th, 2008 at 11:36 am
Oldlefty gave us some historical context:
That’s the fact, jack. Though I would say it goes back further than that. The whole Middle East current status is due to European and American meddling. We set up a bunch of fake countries to deal with, so we could grab their resources.
But I would be interested in hearing your view on what we should do now with Iran? And whether you feel them a reasonably imminent threat?
September 24th, 2008 at 11:51 am
Once again Old Lefty turns it into an Anti-US thing.
The shia cleric hate ANYONE who isn’t their type of Muslim.. and have to inevitably hate all Non-Muslim world powers, becuae that is their religious mandate.
The radical Islamists both Sunni and Shia hated the US long before the Post-WW-II era.
And UM Cara: Thank you! Finally someone else on here who knows what’s going on
September 24th, 2008 at 11:52 am
Why does Iran hate Israel? Hmmm.
I agree that they hate us for sticking our noses in, but I think they would hate us regardless.
Obama is upset that Iran’s president was allowed to speak so openly yesterday at the U.N. Why then did he say the next president should sit down and talk with terrorist leaders?
September 24th, 2008 at 12:01 pm
I just read the article about Palin’s meeting with Karzai who said he “found her quite a capable woman. She asked the right questions on Afghanistan.” OMG another man who met with her and found her capable in 10 mintues!
Good grief, I feel SO much better. McCain won’t let her actually answer questions or talk to the American people…we apparently are not capable of making up our own minds. If McCain does not respect the American people enough to think we DESERVE to know about this woman in her own words then I have NO respect for him or his (lack) of thought processes. As for me, I now think she is a “Stepford” candidate who is only allowed to stick to the script. I am so done with these two. I wish the media would quit begging for interviews because frankly I am so over Palin that I don’t even care what she thinks or says anymore.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
Oh my another rant..
>Vince, If you think Cheney has no power you have to prove it. me thinks you make stuff up. Iran has NO NUCLEAR WEAPONS.”eminent threat is too late”
They will have them in a few months.
The IEAUOAPOUPO whatever it’s called has been finding plutonium in trash all over Iran for years.
Regarding Cheney.. i’m not spending any time proving anything to you.
>Thats STILL B.S. Show me the war declaration with any democrats name on it. You can’t.
Most of them supported and signed the Congressional auth. for Iraq War.
>The 911 commission recomended many defense ideas after they convened. your guy implemented NONE OF THEM!
Just like I thought… no ideas.
>“No that isn’t Patriotism. That’s Sedition” What’s sedition? Questioning policy is not sedition. you need to Quit lying.
Attacking the premises of a war while the war is being fault in forums where the enemy is aware of the division is indeed sedition. The time to “question policy” is before the war not during it.
That’s elimentary. Do you people live in the real world or not?
> I never persisted in saying anything . Just pointed out that you seem to support that insane doctrine. “They say it. Almost every day. How brainwashed are you?” Again, Iran is MY enemy? Prove it. You Can’t. “Iran hated us long before Bush came around. And the Islamists hated us before there was even an Israel. You can blame the US for jihad all you want that’s what they’re counting on.” Show me a source for this drivel you paranoid coward. They dont hate me, They hate the policy that your kind endorses.
They hate you. Not every Muslim.. but enough of them. They HATE YOU. They grow up being brainwashed to hate every aspect of your life. They loathe you and think you’re lower than dirt… they think the same of everyone who isn’t like them.
Don’t believe me? Listen to them from thier own words.
This is undercover footage of what they preach in mainstream Muslim mosques in the UK.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=EA0270E133DC8334
>I won’t quiz you on anything. your a very fearful little man that I wouldnt trust to tell the truth about anything! By the way, They could use you in Iraq. They take almost anybody now you know. You should go sign up and support the cause your so worked up about. What am I saying? Liked you’d ever do somthing patriotic like that.
You’re the emotional shill. I know what these people are about. I am not surprised by what they do or say or think. You are the one who has deceived himself into believe the typical 1968 Marxist worldview that the reason why people do things is because of thier economic self-interest. You’re wrong. These people’s entire life revolves around Islam.
All I did was take them seriously and listen to what they say. That’s how “easy” it is . All you have to do is realize they don’t thihnk like you do.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
“Why does Iran hate Israel? ”
Is that a serious question? Not sure
September 24th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
“But I would be interested in hearing your view on what we should do now with Iran? And whether you feel them a reasonably imminent threat?”
……………………………………..
Clearly, I am not a foreign policy expert.
I believe that before we put troops on TWO of their borders and started calling them the Axis of evil, they were getting sick of the clergy, and becoming more pro American.
Remember, after 9/11 they held candelight vigils.
I think that Ahmadinejad is only there because Bush is his American counterpart and they got scared just like people here got scared and stuck with Bush.
I think the war profiteers make them a bigger threat than they are, but it’s time to get the grown ups in.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
“Why does Iran hate Israel? ”
Is that a serious question? Not sure
Posted by Vince P
September 24th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
……………………..
#1. Maybe because the CIA and Massad trained the Savak.
#2. Because WE have a bellicose right wing religious wacko in office, saber rattling and playing to his base, THEY elected a bellicose right wing religious wacko to saber rattle and play to his base, THEY elected
September 24th, 2008 at 12:20 pm
And by the way, being anti bad policy by those who may be corrupted by power, OR just plain wrong, is no more anti American than YOUR criticism of the policies of Democrats who come to power.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:24 pm
Vince,
No it was not a serious question.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
Oldlefty,
Iran has hated Israel regardless of whom we had in office.
I, personally, am a big fan of Israel. The fact that there are hardly any Jews in the rest of the middle east speaks volumes as to the religious tolerance of their neighbors.
We can thank European antisemitism for the need for the state of Israel to exist. Meanwhile we get to pay for half the worlds military to deal with the repercussions, while our European neighbors can afford things like public health care.
September 24th, 2008 at 12:43 pm
Um Cara,
I disagree that Mossadegh would have hated us. Most sources say he was passionate about democracy and American ideals. And he was a secularist, but a nationalist.
Also many so called experts say the shame is that the
Shia – Sunni, divide would have most likely created allies of Israel and Iran, if only there had not been SO much meddling, we will never know.
Weren’t they helping us in Afganistan, right after 9/11
You Thomas Friedman (who I don’t always agree with), said about Iran in 2002:
“They’re now ages 15 to 30. There’s about 18 million of them, and they’re coming of age. They’re wired. They’ve got access to the Internet. There’s a million Internet users there now growing exponentially all the time. They’re tied in to satellite dishes around the world.
They see the good life out there. They want the good life. They want the good jobs. They want to be religious.
I mean they accept that Islam has to have a role in their life but they do not want to be fundamentalists.
They don’t want to be extreme anything because they’ve lived in a society where they’ve had kind of extremism pushed down their throat now for 23 years. ”
His belief was reiterated by others, until the cowboys started threatening them. Then then elected their own wackadoodle.
September 24th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
Oldlefty,
Just to clear up a couple of my views…
I would agree that the average Iranian is not particularly anti-American now, or back in 2002.
Also, I am NOT going to defend the Iraq war, or Bush’s ‘diplomacy’.
But, who is or not elected in Iran has very little to do with who actually has the power. And those with the power, post Shah (who I agree was a bad dude for the Iranian people), have a religious world view that points to inevitable conflict with the non Muslim world. They are who we unfortunately must deal with, not the Iranians Friedman described (and who still very much exist, even post Bush/post Iraq war).
September 24th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
Vinny, You should really quit lying. NO DEMOCRAT ever signed up for a WAR. Get your facts right. quit using hannitty talking points.
September 24th, 2008 at 3:02 pm
Vinny, The PLAGIARIZER, Do you think we should be in an occupation in Iraq with war profiteers Stealing tax dollars to help western oil companies secure the resources?
September 24th, 2008 at 3:06 pm
Uma Cara, You are wrong. Show me where Iranian leaders hate me. YOU CAN’T! You are not a policy maker in this country, they don’t like our meddling with middle eastern politics, i.e. Democracy at gunpoint! Let your heart not be troubled, They are not coming to GET you. You should really be worried about whats happening in this country, your local govt. ect. You efforts will be much more useful here.;-)
September 24th, 2008 at 3:16 pm
Um Cara,
One of my main points is that we don’t know WHAT Iran would have been,( or the region for that matter), without our interference.
During the cold war, we ALWAYS sided with Pakistan over India.
It’s easier to do business with a dictator than a messy democracy, and so India took aid from the Soviets and was in the “Soviet Bloc”.
The first I was in Bombay, (spouse is Indian), there was the Library of The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Wow! coming from the era of duck and cover, I never saw ANYTHING like this.
The Indians were resentful that we armed Pakistan at their expense.
And there was no communist take over of India….look at India now, and look at Pakistan now.
This is my problem with confusing countries who are good for big corporations with countries who are good for democracy….and it always comes back to bite us.
September 24th, 2008 at 3:28 pm
Jeffro said:
Uma Cara,
Its ‘Um’ Cara, I’m a dude, not a chick
You are wrong. Show me where Iranian leaders hate me. YOU CAN’T!
I don’t know whether you are a faithful Shia Muslim or not, so you are correct – I cannot tell you what Ali Khamenei thinks about you.
You are not a policy maker in this country, they don’t like our meddling with middle eastern politics, i.e. Democracy at gunpoint!
True, I am not a policy maker in any country, and no one likes to be on the receiving end of a gun. But the world is a bit more complicated than that.
Let your heart not be troubled, They are not coming to GET you.
Nope, they are more concerned about bringing an end to the world as we know it. They are most certainly not on their way to Brazil to GET me, I agree. And my heart is not troubled, I’m pretty O.K. w/ myself, thanks.
You should really be worried about whats happening in this country, your local govt. ect. You efforts will be much more useful here.;-)
My local government is in Sao Paulo. We are currently in the midst of electing the Mayor (in a 15 million person city, not a small job). One of the candidates recently stated (I’ll translate):
“We can have a different city. You can rape, but don’t kill.”
and of people who complain that teacher’s salaries are too low:
“The problem is not that these teacher’s salaries are low, the problem is that they did not marry better.”
How’s that for local politics?
But at any rate, I can’t participate in my local politics, since I am not a citizen. I can however state my opinion in this public blog, and so can you, and Vince, and everyone else. I’m not really looking for advice on where to spend my efforts though, thanks.
September 24th, 2008 at 3:43 pm
Hey to all you Iran-defending Christian-haters…
I find it remarkable you haven’t commented on Ahmadinejad’s speech at the UN. Towards the end of it he said the following.
I’m amused you tell every LIE imaginable about Sarah Palin regarding her religion because YOU WANT to cast her as a religious freak.
But read what the President of Iran says…. I dont believe you when you complain about Religion.. your silence gives you away.
My Friends,
Fortuitously, opportunities are accessible. With the grace of God Almighty, the existing pillars of the oppressive system are crumbling. Great developments in favor of humankind as well as its true and real rights are on the way. A golden and brilliant future is awaiting mankind.
A global community filled with justice, friendship, brotherhood and welfare is at hand, as I have elaborated. A community which will tread the path of beauty and love under the rule of the righteous and perfect human being, the One promised by all divine prophets and the One who is the true lover of humanity. A community that will be devoid of any fear, despair and privation. Such a community will soon be ours. The community promised by the great divine Prophets Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus Christ and Mohammad (PBUH) is about to materialize.
Let us, hand in hand, expand the thought of resistance against evil and the minority of those who are ill-wishers. Let’s support goodness and the majority of people who are good and the embodiment of absolute good that is the Imam of Time, The Promised One who will come accompanied by Jesus Christ, and accordingly design and implement the just and humanistic mechanisms for regulating the constructive relationships between nations and governments.
Oh great Almighty, deliver the savior of nations and put an end to the sufferings of mankind and bring forth justice, beauty, and love.
==============================
Do you realize he’s talking about the Antichrist and False Prophet in Revelation?
Islam’s Mahdi and “Jesus” do the same exact the AC and FP do.
September 24th, 2008 at 3:45 pm
Vinny, Now your calling me names! You are a paranoid delusional republican in melt down mode. Your also a shameless PLAGIARIZER! If you think I’ve never seen your silly cut and paste on other blogs buy similar Chickenhawks such as you, your mistaken. That Tripe has been discredited a long time ago. (when saddam was captured,our mission was done) It all repeats the same thin you wingnuts repeat like lemmings. That saddam was a BAAAAD man. Also if you think your silly post proves Democrats sighned on to be in a never ending WAR. OR ANY WAR for that matter, Than you just are not very smart. and that is the conclusion You have impressed on me. That you are a paranoid little chickenhawk that spew wingnut propaganda because if you ever came to the realization that you have been LIED TO BY THIS ADMINISTRATION, Your head would explode!!! I invite you to join me over at mediamatters and try to spew your drivel, where the posters there are way smarter than me. You will get some facts put in your face (with sources intact) that would humble you into a more rational realistic world view. Wanna join me over there?
September 24th, 2008 at 3:50 pm
Oldlefty,
I don’t disagree with you re: our support of dictators (remember, I live in Latin America – the U.S. supported a few down here too).
And starting with Europe, and then the U.S., outsiders have been meddling with the Middle East for a mighty long time. But we have modern Iran to deal with, not the Persia that might have been (which is too bad, because some very good things came out of ancient Persia).
The modern Iran, granted is a bastardization of what could have been, but it is what we have to deal with, and it is the most likely source of a nuclear attack upon the Western World. The Western World needs to figure out what to do about that, and quick.
I agree with you that the Western World also needs to learn a lesson about messing with other cultures. The Chinese have been much smarter and longer range thinkers in that regard.
September 24th, 2008 at 3:52 pm
Um Cara,
You are from Latin America??
Wow! we have bloody hands, I know, Chili, Guatemala, Hondorous, Nicaragua…Donde los yikes!
I understand what you are saying about the here and now.
I just think a good start is to start to deal fairly with people.
I also think, Bomb,Bomb,Bomb, Bomb,Bomb,Iran is as wacko as Ahmadinejad, and showing weakness, not strength.
Once you said what your screen name means…but I’m sorry to say, I’ve forgotten.
September 24th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
I live in Brazil, and have for the past couple years, but am from Texas.
Um Cara is Brazilian Portuguese slang for ‘a dude’
you would be Uma Mina, ‘a chick’ : )
September 24th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
Oldlefty,
re:
Hey, I don’t know if you are a pacifist or not. If so, there is probably nothing that will convince you that this might be a military situation.
But, I think to deal fairly with people you have to have someone on the other side of the table who wants to deal with you. We don’t have that in Iranian leadership. We have people who think the end of the world is inevitable and is just around the corner, and it is their duty to God to help bring that about.
Don’t take my word for it, don’t take Vince’s word for it, but take a look at how the Iranian government is set up. Take a look at what the real leaders are saying to their own people. Talk to some Iranian immigrants, especially ones who lived for some time under the post shah regime.
Trust me, I’m no bomb em all and let God sort out the rest kind of guy. I’m someone who has been arguing that we need to reduce our military. I was not in favor of the Iraq war. I am someone who has been arguing we need to talk to Iran. Granted, more from the aspect that it will help us get other partners around the world to help deal with them rather than a real expectation that talks will solve the problem.
I do sincerely hope something short of war will be the solution in Iran, but when we are dealing with an irrational party on the other side of the table… I’m not hopeful.
One thing Vince has said a couple of times that is absolutely true – we can not assume that they think the same way we think. If we do that, we will never understand the real threat or what we must do to deal with it.
September 24th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
OK, People tend to think your name is female because a few girls here are named Cara.
I just met a young woman from Brazil.
She’s marrying a Canadian and moving to Northern Canada.
Wow! what a difference huh?
Although I’ve never been to South America, so what do I know?
My kids always chose Brazil as their soccer team, when they played ‘world cup’ in camp.
September 24th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
And everyone always assumes you are a guy, though not sure why – default position I suppose when people don’t know.
Brazil is a good bet on world cup, though they lost the last one (it was when I first moved here, people were not happy).
That’s going to be a tough move for the Brazilian girl. Most of the Brazilians I know are very close to their family, and live with them until they marry. My girlfriend is in her thirties and her mom calls her every night to make sure she is safe if she is not staying at home (yep, she still lives at home). They talk on the phone 5 times a day. And this is pretty normal.
Hope things work out for them! The temperature difference is not going to be the biggest change she is going to have to get used to. Very few Brazilians I have met want to leave Brazil (In contrast to what many Americans think, that everyone is just waiting to illegally cross the border and collect free benefits or something)
September 24th, 2008 at 4:40 pm
The Brazilian girl seemed very family oriented, very sweet.
She brought some Brazilian dessert, I foget what it was called, it was egg yolky, small yellow creamy dabs. very good.
I’m sure she said there was a lot of egg yolk though.
Any way, wish her luck.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
From what I know every Brazilian I met is a nice happy guy.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:25 pm
jeffro has reached the point of Leftist Irrationality.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:28 pm
Indeed, boa sorte to them both! I have a feeling he is going to have a very tearful bride for a while, and it is likely they will have some very high phone bills : )
But they are making a new family, and I’m sure all will be good in the end. Though I place even money on them moving back to Brazil within two years!
The dessert might have been pudim de leite. Good stuff. Keeps your arteries nice and firm.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Time for me to go, but:
“The dessert might have been pudim de leite. Good stuff. Keeps your arteries nice and firm.”
nice and firm, or nice and clogged?
Not that I’m complaining.
September 24th, 2008 at 5:44 pm
If your afraid of an interview with Sean Hannity, how can you handle Ahmadinejad?
September 24th, 2008 at 5:49 pm
Dear Alan
Yesterday at 9:00 PM I watched CNN interview of Ahmadinajad by Larry King. The whole time I was thinking about you and Sean. You or Greta can interview him, may be Sean too. He is a married man with three grown children. Larry King asked him about holocast denial. He paused but he answered. He was speaking “Pharsi” not Arabic. He is a good politician. He was relaxed.
September 24th, 2008 at 7:29 pm
Ahmadinajad is the epitome of a charismatic evil. This is not a man to try to play “gotcha” with.. nor someone you want to give a public platform to. He is very intelligent and thrives in a debate.
He is a great study of the West and knows how to play silly Leftists like a violin with ease.
That is why the Columbia thing last year was a tragic mistake.
This is a dangerous evil man and he shouldn’t be played with .. he needs to be killed.
September 24th, 2008 at 7:50 pm