Will Law And Order Conservatives Attack Bush For His 14 Pardons?
They never stop talking about the Clinton pardons. I wonder if any of these will bother them. I mean, it’s not like these crooks were as bad as Mark Rich. All they did was drug offenses, tax evasion, wildlife violations, bank embezzlement, hazardous waste, food stamps, and the theft of government property. Among the pardoned:
Leslie Owen Collier of Charleston, Mo., who pleaded guilty in 1995 to unlawfully killing three bald eagles in southeast Missouri. He improperly used pesticide in hamburger meat to kill coyotes, but ended up killing many other animals, including the bald eagles. Collier, who was convicted for unauthorized use of a pesticide and violating the Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act, was sentenced Feb. 2, 1996 in the Eastern District of Missouri.
Andrew Foster Harley of Falls Church, Va. Harley was convicted of wrongful use and distribution of marijuana and cocaine during a general court martial at the U.S. Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs, Colo.
Obie Gene Helton of Rossville, Ga., whose offense was unauthorized acquisition of food stamps.
Most intriguing is what pardons may be yet to come.
One hot topic of discussion related to pardons is whether Bush might decide to issue pre-emptive pardons before he leaves office to government employees who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. Some constitutional scholars and human rights groups want the incoming administration of President-elect Barack Obama to investigate possible war crimes.
Your comparison of the Bush and Clinton pardons is absurd. You’re free to make any arguments you wish but you lose credibility when they are not rooted in fact, but rather your liberal prejudices. None of President Bush’s pardons have gone to fugitives that fled the country, as did Marc Rich. None of Bush’s pardons, I presume, have been done at the behest of the estranged wife of said fugitive, who also happened to be a major fundraiser for Clinton. There are enough legitimate issues to discuss Alan — don’t insult our intelligence by bottom feeding!
November 24th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
The ‘preemptive’ pardons are the ones I’m concerned about.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:08 am
Do you really believe what you say? You are an idiot if you do.
Sadly, if you had been near Jim Jones you would have gone for him, moved with him, and then handed out the kool aid before drinking it yourself.
You do not really look long term. You just look at the short term and think that someone’s daddy will come in and take care of all of your mistakes.
November 25th, 2008 at 1:57 am
HI Allen-glad I found your blog.
I am looking forward to hearing your comment away from Fox.
I could not watch much of you on TV because Hannity was so brutal to Obama.I found him very offensive.
But I would like to hear what you have to say here.
You seem like a good man.
November 25th, 2008 at 4:29 am
Alan, I am so glad to see you are moving on. I consider myself an independent, and have been a faithful watcher of H & C for at least 8 years and I am absolutely sick of the way you defend every action and word of any liberal, regardless of how absurd. My wife and I just recently made the decision we were going to exercise our rights, and turn the channel.. Informed viewers want to hear both sides of the story, but we don’t want somebody to be a talking point… Often I wonder if you could really believe some of the nonsense you say or if they pay you to say the opposite of whatever Hannity says (We are sick of him too… but at least occassionally he will call a duck what it is)
As for me, I supported John McCain… but now that Obama has been elected, He is my president 100% and I support him whole heartedly and respect the Office of the President. I just hope you are not leaving to take a position in his cabinet.. or maybe you should consider going back to comedy.
November 25th, 2008 at 7:08 am
The power to pardon is a perversion of the constitution and a subversion of the justice system.
November 25th, 2008 at 7:47 am
Leslie Owen spent more time in prison for inadvertantly killing three bald eagles than the average person spends behind bars for murder of another human being.
I find that rather absurd!!!!
November 25th, 2008 at 7:55 am
[...] “Will law and order conservatives attack Bush for his 14 pardons?” asks Alan Colmes, the soon-to-be-former partner of Sean Hannity on Fox News, at his blog, Liberaland. “They never stop talking about the Clinton pardons. I wonder if any of these will bother them. I mean, it’s not like these crooks were as bad as Mark Rich. All they did was drug offenses, tax evasion, wildlife violations, bank embezzlement, hazardous waste, food stamps, and the theft of government property. ” [...]
November 25th, 2008 at 9:05 am
Of course they won’t attack Bush. He could pardon Osama bin Laden and they’d be quiet.
BTW, Rocky: the power to pardon is in the Constitution, which cannot be a perversion of itself. Read it. You might learn something.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:33 am
Shun Hannesty, O’Real Lies, El Limbo have failed to deliver what they get pay for. They will be convicted by Mccain and the republicans. Will they get a pardon from Bush?
November 25th, 2008 at 10:41 am
John R.,
Your comparison of the Bush and Clinton pardons is absurd.
Your entire message was a comparison of Bush and Clinton pardons – so you too are absurd.
November 25th, 2008 at 10:55 am
Alan,I truly, truly respect you and your opinions. Sorry, but, I hav NO RESPECT FOR HANNITY/NOR RUSH L., Nor any and all Conservative Talk Hosts/Hostess. I relish opinions, mixed as well, free society, freedom of opinion, but, THIS RIGHT WING TALK STUFF, TALKING POINTS – OUTRIGHT LIES – MAKES ME SICK, SICK, TO MY MIND/STOMACH. THANKS FOR YOUR ‘OPEN MIND’ OPINION/VIEWPOINT. SO VERY HAPPY YOU ARE GOING ON YOUR OWN SHOW, AWAY FROM HANNITY. GOOD LUCK.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:34 am
I find it absurd to suggest any sort of equivalency between pardoning somebody guilty of accidentally poisoning eagles with pardoning the FALN domestic terrorists who deliberately set off bombs with the objective of terrorizing those who disagreed with them. But then, you do seem to favor illogical arguments of equivalency Mr. Colmes.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:46 am
Question for Herb N:
How much koolaid have you had today?
The comparison of the Bush and Clinton pardons is like comparing oranges and peanuts: not even two fruits. Poor posting Alan.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
Alan, I hate to see you leave Hannity and Colmes. Then again, your purchase of headache pills and powders will go down, being away from the noise. Good Luck!
November 25th, 2008 at 12:23 pm
“BTW, Rocky: the power to pardon is in the Constitution…”
Yeah I know.
“…the Constitution which cannot be a perversion of itself.”
It is a perversion of the rest of the document, the government it establishes, and the democratic spirit it represents. It is a slap in the face to every citizen who willingly gives of their time to sit on a jury and make their best effort to give a fair hearing to the evidence in a case and to put their own biases and preconceptions aside in order to render a verdict that is fair and just. It is a power divined from emperors and kings and it has no place in a country which aspires to be “of the people, by the people, and for the people.”
“Read it. You might learn something.”
Yeah, Arf-Arf! Thanks for the tip.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:50 pm
Naw the “law and order” wingnuts dont ever criticize anything one of their own does. Thats one of the reasons they are dead as a political party. They just keep sucking down Karls Kool aid and listening to that Fat idiot/ dope fiend/ child molester, Rush Limbaugh, and beleive whatever he tells them to.
November 25th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
The comparison of the Bush and Clinton pardons is like comparing oranges and peanuts: not even two fruits. Poor posting Alan.
Posted by bill
What the hell are you talking about, Bill? Herb said nothing of the Bush pardons in his post.
November 25th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Considering the fact that the conservative media simply reads verbatim the talking points they get from the RNC – unless the GOP actually turns against Bush and his criminal cohorts it is very unlikely we will hear anything other than the usual race-baiting, gay-hating and woman-bashing that has made Rush, Sean and Savage the wonderful people we know them to be.
November 25th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
“It’s about time Fox fired you. Hannity needs a competent liberal as counter, instead of lame mental midget like you. This article is just more evidence of just how lame you are. Posted by Occam”
Man, are you stupid. Alan isn’t getting fired if he’s getting another show. Hannity needs to get some competentcy himself. How many times do I have to listen to him repeat himself over and over and over about Ayers and Wright? I find more intelligence on the Factor so I stopped listening to Hannity. Has he finally stopped the express? I’ll tune back in when he talks real issues.
You what is lame? People who are so scared of differing points of view that they use terms like ‘mental midget’ to try and demean others. Alan represents one of the last useful media figures in our society. He has done more for America and political discourse than you ever will. Your just an angry little worm screaming at the fish to back off. Alan is the fish. King fish!!!
November 25th, 2008 at 2:39 pm
Alan,ratings speak for them self,you are an even better host on the radio,solo interview’s kool,calm and collective.I know you had to restrain your self on H&C,but I seen you unleash on Karl Rove and Dick Morris both former Chief of Staff for Bush and Clinton,and other Presidential Advisers,U.N Amb.Gov.Sen.Ect.Ect.I don’t know where these jealous,clown,haters,Liberal&Conservative are coming from but they’re not well informed.Alan,you are above, all the above,Good Luck and BTW ya got some CHANGE…
November 25th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
Alan makes a good point, the conservative punditry REAMS the left regularly for things they’ll let slide for Republicans…
But… These pardons and commutations aren’t nearly as extensive as the Clinton’s. I haven’t looked up every case so I don’t know if there’s any nearly as bad or bought like Mark Rich, but some of the ones I did see things written on (commuting EXTREMELY long sentences for nonviolent drug offenses) seemed sensible to me.
This is just testing the water, we still have a little over a month for some last minute shenanigans.
Also, sorry to hear you leaving H&C, but congrats on scoring a new show of your own! Don’t let them bury you in weekend obscurity!
November 25th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
One thing I’ve learned from being around conservatives since 1966…..Conservatives will attack on anything that seems contrary to whatever vision they think the cave people would do. In fact, I’ve often wondered if they protested the advent of fire since if God wanted it warm, He would have turned up the sun.
November 25th, 2008 at 8:28 pm
Face it! They don,t know how without being baked by someone in their party and the right wing pundits.
November 25th, 2008 at 8:35 pm
Alan, you are the best. I am so glad you are leaving that crazy nut Hannity. He is so loud, and I guess he thinks that’s the only way he can get his point across. I look forwad to listening to you, Randy, Lionel, chris matthews, and especially keith olberman. I always go on this website, you are so entertaining and truthful.
November 25th, 2008 at 11:13 pm
Alan, without you, I wouldn’t watch two minutes of the program. The best time was when Hannity wasn’t there and someone with ratinale thought was sitting in for him. Hell, even Steele did a much better job than Sean Hannity. Hannity doesn’t understand….his greatest loss since Obama’s election will not be the fairness doctrine…but, access. He just lost all access to the administration, the executive branch, and pretty much, any legitimate democrat. He is losing his access to any meaningful information….and for him, any information is almost meaningful since when you live in fairyland, reality is but a dream.
November 26th, 2008 at 12:40 am
How about a No Pardons Amendment…wouldn’t that be nice!
November 26th, 2008 at 1:22 am
good luck!you are the only reason to watch fox news,even greta’s gone whacko since palin.hope you get a t.v. deal&get harsher with the right wing nut jobs.we deserve a voice in the media,though fox lies about msm being liberal.pray for a franken win just to watch fat sean&fat rush heads explode. lib in tx
November 26th, 2008 at 1:24 am
by the way,bush1 pardoned an anti-castro bomber of an airliner resulting in the deaths of over 150 people.compare that to tax fraud?now watch bush2 pardon murderous border patrol agents trying to kill a pot smuggler,libby,rove,gonzales,meiers,norquist,delay,reed,abramoff et al. lib in tx
November 26th, 2008 at 1:42 am
I’m trying to decide which pardon bothers me the most/least.
November 26th, 2008 at 7:03 am
Willy, Collier didn’t “inadvertently” kill bald eagles (or the rest of the animals, including how many animals that might have fed off the carcasses of the poisoned animals).
Anyone growing up in the Bootheel of Missouri knows damn well it’s a federal offense to kill bald eagles, and if you set out poison willy-nilly, you’re going to be killing a whole mess of other animals besides your targetted kill.
He just didn’t care.
He didn’t seem to have any prior offenses, so it’s a bummer they made an example of him, but he majorly screwed up, not only from a legal standpoint, but an ecological standpoint.
I’ll save my “you been sprung” toast for the wrapping cocaine smuggler.
November 26th, 2008 at 9:52 am
Did or did not G.W Bush want to pardon Ken Lay of Enron Inc.Fellow Texans.
November 26th, 2008 at 4:40 pm
How did they make an example of Collier? He was sentenced to two years probation. That does not seem overly harsh to me. He just wanted the right to carry guns again. So, he worked hard to try to get a pardon. I don’t believe that a person that would indiscriminately kill wildlife should ever be allowed to hunt.
November 27th, 2008 at 7:16 pm
[...] Colmes (who will give up his sidekick gig on Fox News with Sean Hannity at the end of the year) wonders on his blog whether conservatives will attack President George Bush for his 14 latest pardons. He [...]
November 28th, 2008 at 7:04 am
UM Cara — I don’t understand the point you were attempting to make when you criticized my post. Alan’s original post was ridiculous not because it attempted to compare pardons across Administrations, but because the “logic” the comparisons were rooted in was based not in fact but rather innuendo and hyperbole. In general, I don’t believe there’s anything wrong with comparing pardons. In fact, it’s probably a useful exercise for a variety of reasons, and any reasonable analysis of the Clinton pardons versus the Bush pardons likely would come to the conclusion that while some of Clinton’s were political paybacks, Bush’s (to date) are not. That’s not exactly breaking big news, which further highlights my original point — Alan’s post was absurd. But the post was not intended as a criticism of the endeavor itself. Just wanted you to understand because your post indicates you clearly did not.
November 28th, 2008 at 8:46 pm
What about OJ?
December 1st, 2008 at 10:29 am
Free the OJ! AND the vodka!
December 1st, 2008 at 10:56 am
First of all, I don’t use a bogus name to say what I think.If someone doesn’t like what I say and wants to look for me ,that’s fine.I just worry about what’s going to happen to them when they find me.Now, pardoning people who were obviously innocent is fine with me.I’m tired of DA’s saying “I now know he didn’t do it ,but a jury found him guilty so he stays in jail” or “If I torture people but have my Attorney General refuse to define torture then it’s not torture yet”.My favorite of all time is the fact that 18 or 20 fools with skills and Saudi money pulled off 911 and Bush, who I voted for twice, sat back with Chaney and said”Now we can tell the big lie Hitler often talked about.We’ll keep them cowering for years while we line our pockets from the Treasury and OIL.We give our friends contracts in Iraq for doing nothing and no one will know that our boys and girls are being killed guarding oil tankers to Kuwait.Did you ever ask yourself why a Hummphy would drive down a straight road when it could zig and zag off and on the terrain so no one could be prepared to detonate a “Roadside Device” The whole idea is to loose the boys and girls “not the oil”.Some say I’m cinical but I was raised in Hell’s Kitchen on welfare after escaping Germany in 1943 at the age of three.A Jew with a German last name.I served in Viet Nam as a Marine Scout Sniper and returned home decorated to become a Police Officer.I then went back into the entertainment business.So I’ve seen and heard it all.When the guys at the “TOP” steal you will find everyone else stealing until you destroy the whole nation.That’s what happened!Hannity is a loud mouth and a personal Bully.It’s not what he says,it’s the stupid way he does it.Colmes was always a gentleman and although I didn’t like it when he recited the party Mantra when he knew it was bull, I liked him.As far as I’m concerned,anyone going to Washington on Jan. 21,2009 should be Assistant Attoney Generals armed with arrest warrants.Let me give you something to think about.If, with all of the illegal immigration from everywhere,the financial collapse, the moral decay,the racial hatred, we have civil unrest the first order of business will be to suspend the Bill of Rights and the Constitution and declare Martial Law.Why do you think the government has outfitted local Law Enforcement with automatic weapons,tanks,armoured vehicles as well as Army uniforms and flak jackets with coorinated training.Will it happen soon,no, but it’s a logical step in the future to stabilize the country if it gets worse or intollerable.Good luck Mr.Colmes
Nate Jaeger
wemix.com
famecast.com
natejaeger.com
soundclick.com
December 1st, 2008 at 11:05 am
Alan you are bottom feeding again.
Please be happy with your liberal friends and smile!!
December 1st, 2008 at 11:29 am
Lord let us all live free and for those who have not committed any crime let them throw the first stone the punishment of others for the rest of their lives for simple crimes they commit must end. We all deserve a second chance at life. I would like to see some changes in the laws that make it legal to deprive someone of their life and hold them hostage in a country that their people slaved for and recieved nothing for the atrosities that were committed on their people.
December 1st, 2008 at 11:57 am
Golly, Pat Beck. What an invaluable, intelligent contribution to Liberaland. The hours it must have taken you to produce such insight! “Alan you are bottom feeding again.”
Gee willikers, Alan…I might have to swing to the left after seeing the super-brain powers of Pat Beck. She/he/it has persuaded me for sure, yessireebob!
December 1st, 2008 at 12:23 pm
I feel the harsh interrogation tactics are a necessity in some extreme cases. Was it abused? It may have been. How do we determine when it is necessary? Where do we draw that line? I think that is a question that everyone would answer differently. For that reason, I think my tax dollars would be better spent on something other than investigating/charging anyone for these tactics.
As a republican, I do not agree with all of Bush’s pardons. This country has a huge drug problem and allowing anyone convicted on drug charges to go free is a big mistake. The eagle killings were completely by mistake, and were not intentional, thus, the pardon is acceptable.
On the issue of conservative vs. liberal bickering…
When is everyone going to realize that they both do the same things? They both ignore what people in their own party do and bash the other party for doing the same things. Neither party knows how to run a “clean” campaign. I tend to see liberals evading direct questions and turning to talking point, but I would guess that liberals would see conservatives doing the same.
As for Alan C leaving H & C, he will be missed.
December 1st, 2008 at 2:30 pm
Why doesnt W pardon the two INS agents convicted of violating the drug dealers civil rights when they shot him? Those guys deserve a pardon!
No, he will isssue pardons for Paulson, Cheney, Bernanke and the rest of the TARP Thieves, the “TARP Multitudes”. These are the guys who have stolen more from the US taxpayer than all the crooks ever, includeing Bernie Ebbers!
December 1st, 2008 at 4:21 pm
They do not….read the facts about the case rather than the blather fed to people by the radical right….you will find that the two agents were far from solid citizens and deserved actually more than they got…they were guilty as hell.
December 1st, 2008 at 4:32 pm
good for you,alan.
i feel bad for hannity,guys like him look through a very foggy window
the problem with him and Fox News is that they are stuck in the conservative mold,they can’t shift and change shapes like MSNBC and CNN can.
December 1st, 2008 at 5:19 pm
they Absolutely deserve a pardon. It is amazing to me we can hire any border guards after the way our own country treated those two guys trying to protect us!
December 1st, 2008 at 5:23 pm
Well, hopefully this will discourage bad border guards from seeking employment from us in the first place. Good riddance! Hopefully this WILL discourage guards of that ilk from applying.
December 1st, 2008 at 5:40 pm
Careful what you wish for.
December 1st, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Colmes has a way of being insulting to ones intelligence. I think the conservatives and liberals both are one brick shy a load and let logic go right out the door.
While both are crooked it appears to me the Democrats are better at it
December 1st, 2008 at 5:55 pm
If the liberals don;t like the way we treat the people who had something to do with or had knowledge of these acts on 9-11 then tell them to go to hell or better yet get the hell out of the country and go live with those idiots who killd allthe Americans that day…GOD BLESS AMERICA AND ALL OUR TROOPS FOR THEIR DEDICATION.
December 1st, 2008 at 7:01 pm
I am an Independent and am glad that Allan is moving on. Let me explain. Journalists are supposed to report what is seen and witnessed. Talk show hosts express thier own opinions. Too many ‘mainstream’ media reporters put in their political bent on ‘news’. So, in that respect, Fox is far better when reporting news; even my harcore Liberal friends will admit to that. Hannity, Rush, et al are not reporters! They are talk show hosts who so far have beat the pants off of their Liberal counterparts in the Talk Show market. Not even funding from George Soros and MoveOn.Org has been able to save them. I don’t know why, but Liberals just can’t seem to succeed at Talk Shows. Allan Colmes will be a fresh choice to tune in to. If you don’t like him, flip the channel. Allan Colmes may well be able to do what Kieth Olberman, with his hatred for all things conservative, and Chris Matthews have not. In fact, I can’t even put Olberman nor Matthews in the same class as Allan Colmes. The Left needs a fresh, knowledgable voice like Allan. He has as much conviction as does anyone on the Right. You can’t call Rush crazy and not think that Kieth Olberman is just as crazy! Olberman is downright hateful. Now, Allan Colmes, that is something else. He is Liberal and proud of it; he defends Liberalism to a fault. But so do his counterparts with Conservatism. Granted, I don’t agree with everything he says, but he is a far more superior host than Olberman/Matthews. Tell you what. If Allan Colmes were to have a show in the time slot that crazy Olberman or dumb Maddow have, I bet that MSNBC’s ratings in that slot will jump up and Fox’s ratings in that slot will drop. Get more folks like Allan Colmes to offer an opposing show to Hannity and O’Reilly in the same time slot and now you have real competition. Can you imagine having Allan Colmes and Sean Hannity on at the same time on different networks analyzing the same political issue? Now, that is something to look forward to – the ratings will yield more accurate information in our choices of politics and its issues. Raging and ranting at Talk Show hosts on the Right won’t help the Left’s lack of attractive talk show hosts. And for all my hardcore Liberal friends, suck it up. Fox is up against the Big 3 and their affiliates; talk about unevenly matched. Fox must be doing something right. There must be a reason why even Liberals tune in to Fox, only to say they hate this host or that host. Maybe if Allan Colmes was given the chance to go up against his counterparts in Prime Time…Let’s see where this goes.
I am routing for Allan. I hope he ends ups opposite these guys so many Liberals complain about.
December 1st, 2008 at 8:09 pm
bush 2 has pardoned s&l crooks with involement with his criminal brothers.just wait,he will pardon the crooked&murderous border patrol agents as well.bush 1 pardoned unrepentant domestic terrorist who killed innocent people on airliner.shut the **** about rich pardon! lib in tx
December 1st, 2008 at 8:38 pm
P.S. Did you notice that the Army has increased the Homeland Reaction Force from 5000 to 20,000 men.CNN news mentioned it Monday.You normally need a 100 to one ratio so it is still not a Martial Law Force but it is illegal under the Constitution to form it for the purposes they state.Of course if you suspend the Constitution it won’t matter.In the short term you have a force to use now that no one is opposing.Step One.
Nate Jaeger
natejaeger.com
December 2nd, 2008 at 9:31 am
Mike C.
Well said. I am a conservative and I agree with you about Alan Colmes. I also agree the Olberman and Matthews do seem over the top with rather hateful slurs about anything conservative.
At least Alan has respect for differing opinions. I don’t agree with Alan a whole lot but he will let those who differ have their say.
Alan does agree that the Fairness Doctrine is a bad thing to bring back.
December 2nd, 2008 at 9:38 am
[...] instruments); Andrew Foster Harley (wrongful use and distribution of marijuana and cocaine) .Will Law And Order Conservatives Attack Bush For His 14 Pardons?Andrew Foster Harley of Falls Church, Va. Harley was convicted of wrongful use and distribution of [...]
December 30th, 2008 at 5:51 am
Alan, didn’t realize how much your presence is missed on the former H & C show; hope you post here some time telling us how your new project may be developing; Hope all is well.
January 30th, 2009 at 10:37 pm