Let Us Not Forget Another Unnecessary Murder
It’s important to note that the killing of an army recruiter doing his job should, like the killing of George Tiller, be roundly condemned. One private was killed and another wounded by a gunman identified as Abdulhakim Mujahid Muhammad. Just as Dr. George Tiller was serving women and ensuring their reproductive rights, Pvt. William A. Long of Conway, Arkansas, was serving his country when he was gunned down. Pvt. Quinton Ezeagwula remains in stable condition as a result of the shooting.
Muhammad, who was born Carlos Bledsoe, says he was angry about wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. He is a recent convert to Islam, having done so on a trip to Yemen. Contrary to those who wish to make it a left/right deal comparing this heinous act to the one that cost George Tiller his life, both shootings need to be condemned unequivocally.
Yes, both murders should be condemned unequivocally. Tiller was performing late-term abortions LEGALLY (unfortunately), despite how evil and horrific they were. Vigilante justice is not something we should tolerate.
–
“Dr. George Tiller was serving women and ensuring their reproductive rights”
Just like slave traders were serving farmers and ensuring their slavemaster rights. Rights shouldn’t be rights if they are grossly immoral, Alan and my fellow lib friends.
Joel Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:10 pm
Here comes the abortion debate. Let’s see how many minds will be changed.
flap Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:15 pm
I can’t help it, Joel, I’m a one-issue guy. I don’t necessarily believe people’s minds will ever be changed, but that doesn’t mean we should stop talking about it.
I think a lot of conservatives rightly or wrongly attach their conservative status mainly on this issue. Besides, Alan has made several posts about Tiller’s death.
trees are people too Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:36 pm
Do you ever change your mind about anything Joel?
Something more substantive than, well I was going to buy a six of Bud, but I changed my mind and went with Coors instead……
Are you open to inquiry, or are you dead set in your opinion?
Joel Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:40 pm
Trees, don’t insult me. Goodbye.
trees are people too Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:50 pm
I didn’t mean to insult you Joel.
I’m curious if you are unwavering in your opinion, and if I’ve insulted you please allow and accept my apologies.
Have a good night Joel, and once again I am sorry.
Joel Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:04 pm
Apology accepted. The short answer to your question is yes. Every reasonable person changes their mind from time to time. But I have never seen a person change their mind about abortion (at least not without a religious conversion). So it ends up being the same old life-versus-choice debate, with the same set of arguments from each side.
trees are people too Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:33 pm
I’d agree.
EricG Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:38 pm
“Here comes the abortion debate. Let’s see how many minds will be changed”
Changing minds everyday over here, Joel.
It’s all about the words you use and if the person your talking to wants to change their mind in the first place. You can’t switch a hardcore anything into anything else but most people are not in such categories. Most people are in the middle or have only so much information that they accept as true.
You have a strong point in that abortion is an issue where finding the ‘gray’ is tough, if not impossible.
But people really do come to better understanding as long as we don’t all spit nails and scalp each other instead of having a debate. That’s the problem with the Anti-Choice v Pro-Choice thing … I think.
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:07 pm
Yes, both murders are just as horrible.
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:12 pm
Eloquently stated, ALAN. Kudos!
average james Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:22 pm
Jared,
We agree !!!!!
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:57 pm
Actually, you and I agree on a good number of things, JAMES…but it’s good to have confirmation once and a while, yes?
;)
Phill Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:19 pm
Jared,what’s the Date??I read your comments on this?and I read the news hours ago,but no date??
Phill Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:37 pm
this sucks,I really don’t have the venom left in me for this guy, You guys take of this, no sympathy
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:56 pm
You’re gonna have to make sense if you want an answer. What, specifically, are you asking for?
Phill Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:06 am
LOL,HAHAHA,date,comprende,the date this when happened on.The media sucks on the coverage of this.The DATE this happened on??the newspaper I read didn’t have the Date this happened on.Like I(LOOK Jared,your Confrimation) said I read your comments on this,and read the news hours ago,No Date this happened on.Specific enough!!!LOL
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:08 am
PHILL,
Ok..I’ll do your homework for you…but I fail to see the hilarity of the situation…perhaps you could explain why/how you think it’s funny?
1 June 2009
pino Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:09 am
I remember my first beer.
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:17 pm
Wrong is wrong. This is wrong. These men were simply doing their job. This sucks.
Pvt. Long was murdered.
Dr. Tiller was murdered.
Both shooters need to be brought to trial and charged with murder.
No death penalty.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:58 pm
Agreed. :)
average james Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 10:18 pm
Hahahaha
June 2nd, 2009 at 9:20 pm
DANIELLE, and all others against Christianity,
I hate to do this…but I’m seeing a bit of a double standard here:
This guy is muslim…where’s your anti-islam rhetoric. If Mr. Tiller was killed by a christian fanatic (your words…not mine), is this guy a muslim fanatic? And if so…why are you reluctant to say so?
Danielle Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 5:35 am
What!?!?!?
What did I say that “was against Christianity”?
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:13 am
Danielle never said she “was against Christianity”.
This guy is just another far right wing religious fanatic, they are all the same.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:28 am
consider it collatoral damage for aligning yourself with the anti-christians…however I’m going to guess that your implication that all southern baptists are crazy is what constitutes your “against christianity” message.
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:37 am
Who is “collateral damage”, and who put out an “against christianity” message?
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:53 am
Danielle…and I don’t know who put out an against christianity message, however Danielle did agree that all southern baptists are crazy…and I was supposing that’s why her name got put on the accusation.
I’m not calling anyone anything, and perhaps I should assume the role of Switzerland in this, instead of the UN
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:55 am
I must have missed that.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:02 am
it’s on the running mate of Alan Keyes thread. if you click on her name though You can see all of her recent comments.
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:12 am
I try to make a point of NOT talking other posters, but it looks like she is talking about ione small group, that she feels is preverting Christianity.
Plus, staements like,
“No, he is a piece of crap for his hateful mentality and for the way he portrays Christianity!” is not “anti Christian.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:53 am
though the southern baptists are not a small group, most christians take umbrage of attacks on fellow christian groups, because most christian denomonations have scant differences. Although most christians condemn the attitude of the crazy group that protests at funerals, taking shots at such a big group as the southern baptists will raise the ire of most other christians.
I don’t think anything she said is anti-christian myself, I was simply trying to point out why she may have been included/called out.
People like Ericg and Rocky are anti-christian, and that guy who called in tonight that Alan hung up on in order to avoid the lightning strikes.
Daddio Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:55 am
“This guy is just another far right wing religious fanatic, they are all the same.”–Lefty.
I hope you’re not talking about this converted muslim Lefty. If you are referring to this muslim convert then you just qualified as a far left wing wacko.
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 8:01 am
“If you are referring to this muslim convert then you just qualified as a far left wing wacko.”
…………………….
Of course he’s a right wing extremist….He IS the same as the abortion guy: obsessed with guns, God, gays and gametes, just like those in the frontier of Pakistan and Afganistan…..religious zealots who think that God justifies their violence.
Daddio Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 8:07 am
He is just another nutcase, a terrorist. I do not lable him right or left. He is a murderer just as the one who murdered Tiller. Just as the Uno bomber was a nutcase.
Danielle Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:11 pm
GuidoVanHorn ~
I know you’ll find this hard to believe, but I am a practicing Christian (Catholic). I just can’t handle all of those crazy Evangelicals (mostly Southern Baptists). Ironically, they usually exhibit the most hateful, non-Christ-like behavior of us all (at the same time walking around acting like they’re so much more morally superior than the rest of us. I’m sure they’re some that don’t act that that, I just don’t happen to know any.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:19 pm
DANIELLE,
Be just a bit more disingenuous, will ya?
I just can’t handle all of those crazy Evangelicals (mostly Southern Baptists).
So, here we have ONE Southern Baptist preacher that makes an awful statement…and now ALL Southern Baptists are crazy evangelicals?
Hi…My name is Jared…I don’t subscribe to ANY of the descriptors you’ve just listed…and I was raised Southern Baptist.
Now…how would you feel if said something to the effect of: All Catholics are pedophiles? Do you see the similarity in the umbrella statement you made and the one I just made?
Danielle Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 10:15 pm
Jared ~
I have stated several times on here that I base beliefs by what I see. I wish so badly I could meet a nice ultra conservative evangelical southern baptist and walk away with a good impression, but so far I have found none. I didn’t say there aren’t any……I just personally don’t. I don’t have time tonight, but one I will try to compile a list of all the horrible statements and stories I have dealt with first hand….maybe then you will understand why I’m not overly excited when I meet one.
And your comparison – the two things don’t equate.
You want to equate the immoral, illegal behavior of a few priests that have very much harmed children……to…….the very large mentality of a lot of other different denominations that feel the exact same way I do (Catholics, Lutherans, Episcopal, Methodists, United Church of Christ, etc). So there are many many people that have a less than desirable opinion of many Evangelicals / Southern Baptist. I read a book a few years ago, but can’t think of the name right now – but they used the term “religious narcissism” when describing many Evangelical. After my experiences with them, I must say it is a very fitting term.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 10:20 pm
Danielle
There are more than a few priests. I have catholic friends and I don’t blame or label them for what immoral priests have done.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:37 pm
DANIELLE,
I doubt very much that you would ever meet a “nice, ultra-conservative evangelical southern baptist” that you’re looking for…but only due to your preconceived opinions about them. I hope you do, one day.
My comparison was to point out your disingenuous statement that most evangelicals are wack-jobs.
To that I said, most catholics are pedophiles.
You made a disingenuous statement…I made a disingenuous statement. Seems pretty clear to me.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 3:20 am
Danielle,
I don’t presume anyones church membership, however from your statement I could guess that you weren’t southern baptist;)
I having never been to the south can’t say I’ve had much contact with those espousing the Southern Baptist Convention, however I do know many good people that claim to be Baptists and evangelicals, and some not so good…but I’ll focus on the positive.
I’ve certainly seen my fair share of evangelicals who’s beliefs and worship patterns are completely foreign to me. For me, yelling, screaming and loud chants and audience members shouting back at the preacher as he yells and screams hell fire and damnation over the rock music that the church “choir” is playing is not my idea of a church I’d like to attend, never mind the fierce doctrinal issues that I have with them, but to each their own, and I’ll afford them their right to worship in whatever manner they please. Most are good people just trying to make their way through life, and I’ll wish no ill upon them.
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:00 pm
well some of our anti-islam rhetoric is spread thru out Irag and Afghanistan in the form of troops and bombs. but I bet you want something printed right?
craig7120 Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:08 pm
lol @irag
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:56 pm
Unbelievable, CRAIG…you just can’t bring yourself to do it, can you?
NewsFlash from Obama himself: We are not at war with Islam.
Ditto-head.
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:10 am
LOL so you do want it printed… petty? yes.
Jared I denounce all forms of war. Including the religion of Islam and their jihads that hides behind the wall of intimidation to achieve unrecognizable goals.
Sincerely,
Craig
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:13 am
CRAIG ,
well-done, my friend. I knew you could do it.
How else am I supposed to know where you stand if you don’t state it clearly? I’m not a liberal…I don’t pretend to know your intent…
How else are YOU supposed to know where you stand if you don’t affirm your beliefs in front of people?
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:28 am
Dude ur kidding right? Ive spouted off numerous times on this Islam issue, At least christianity takes its lumps. You insult islam and they show up on your front door. Screw that fanaticism, that religion is as intolerant as anything can be. I try not to bastardize christianity in the same way but current actions is making it difficult. (Tiller)
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:37 am
No, I’m not kidding…your statement is a first-heard for me…but I appreciate you clarifying your position.
average james Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:05 pm
Jared,
I gotta call you on this.
“I’m not a liberal…I don’t pretend to know your intent…”—-Jared
You’ve got to be kidding.
Rush,Hannity,Levin,Savage,Coulter,Ingraham,Beck,Gingrich,Cunningham,Romney, etc………….
The conservative crew consistenetly tells us
“What the real intent behind Obama’s [fill in the blank] is.”
“Here is what these people really want.”
“That is what he said but, here is what he is really thinking.”
And a personal favorite–”These people hate america.”
These amazing mind reading skills go on daily, ad nauseum.
Perhaps conservatives actually do have telepathic mind reading powers.
And green momkeys are gonna fly outta my butt.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:04 pm
JAMES,
I am not, nor do I pretend to be:
Rush,Hannity,Levin,Savage,Coulter,Ingraham,Beck,Gingrich,Cunningham,Romney, etc………….
I said that I don’t pretend to know his intent. However, there are a handful of libs on this site who will take a statement made by whomever, and runaway with it and opine all day long as to the intent. Perhaps I should have qualified my statement and been a bit more specific as to the target of my comment.
Point taken.
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:06 pm
I didn’t mean to insult you Joel.
I’m curious if you are unwavering in your opinion, and if I’ve insulted you please allow and accept my apologies.
Have a good night Joel, and once again I am sorry.
Trees, I disagree with you on some issues. You with me. I also disagree with Joel on a number of issues.
That being said, MAN the F$%^ up here. You didn’t disrespect him or anything.
Here comes the abortion debate. Let’s see how many minds will be changed.
Joel, if you don’t wanna debate abortion, then don’t introduce abortion in the post:
I appreciate the post, I do. Just coulda done without the abortion parallel.
P.S. By the way, pro-life folks are not trying to deny women the right to reproduce.
trees are people too Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:01 am
Pino, I apologized to Joel because he expressed a feeling of being insulted, and it wasn’t my intention to insult him.
Joel has always treated me with respect, and I appreciate his communicating with me.
pino Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:05 am
Then say it. Once. And move on.
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:06 am
Trees, you are too nice…are you turning liberal? :)
trees are people too Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:45 am
Liberal’s are nice??
I met some nice people in Liberal KS once….
But out here in CA liberal’s are nice only as long as you agree with them.
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:50 am
LOL Trees,
Its all geography aint it? Im in a rush amusement park. All is good.
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:05 am
Women who are pro-abortion always use the argument “YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO MY BODY” vis-a-vis abortion. You know what? I don’t care about your body, meaning it’s none of my business.
Relate your uterus to your house. Do I care what you do with your house? NO. If you’re killing children in your house, I do care. I realize it’s “YOUR HOUSE,” but if human lives are being snuffed out in “YOUR HOUSE,” I do care.
And let’s deal with facts. Let’s deal with science. Late-term abortion IS killing very young children.
TDro319 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 5:31 pm
“And let’s deal with facts. Let’s deal with science. Late-term abortion IS killing very young children.”
Unnecessary wars are killing very young children. That’s a fact. No science needed.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:53 pm
Unnecessary wars
That Obama and his Dem Congress just extended…
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:44 pm
No blood for oil! Barack Obama is killing children!
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:42 pm
This guy is muslim…where’s your anti-islam rhetoric.
Not only was this guy Muslim, but so were the brotha’s in NYC that were gonna bomb the Jewish Temples.
Wonder if these brotha’s stopped decided that they needed to ax’d their God about, you know, killing?
Jared, don’t wait for acknowledgment from the Left.
craig7120 Reply:
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:56 pm
I get it pino the ax’d was an asked but spelled diff. because? the issue on Obama is loud and clear now. Not that credibilty means anything but ur done.
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:18 am
nice reaction, and the demeaning nature of your posts was nothing I expected.. wait yeah I did. Its typical. but hey we’re all entitled.
So your saying a nominee to the SC can say ax’d?
Was that the point of that lil post of yours? well done.
June 2nd, 2009 at 11:44 pm
I get it pino the ax’d was an asked but spelled diff. because? the issue on Obama is loud and clear now.
Ding ding ding! Very very clever little craig7120….very well done.
The point, however, is that using racist words doesn’t imply that I am a racists!
See, a nominee to the Sumpreme Court of the United States of America can say that because she is :
A. Latina
B. Woman
makes her better able to decide cases that come before her.
Not that credibilty means anything but ur done.
Ouch.
But then again, you might not have had any to begin with.
Snap!
pino Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:03 am
Maybe I shoulda just said he was retarded.
And then ax’d if he wanted to go bowling.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:10 pm
Retarded like Palin’s kid, you mean? (I’m sure you do, since you’re on a roll here.)
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:51 am
Ok I just saw that ’snap’ well played
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:01 am
Women who are pro-abortion always use the argument “YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO MY BODY” vis-a-vis abortion
Correct. Their argument more resembles an argument against rape than abortion. No one is trying to tell you that you :
A. HAVE to reproduce
B. That you CAN’T reproduce.
We’re just saying that once you CHOOSE to, you can’t kill the kid.
trees are people too Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:38 am
That is an excellent point.
The choice was whether or not to have sex, and liberal’s always frame the argument along the lines of, “we just couldn’t help ourselves, one minute we watching t.v. minding our own business and the next minute there she was….pregnant.
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:08 am
Jared I denounce all forms of war. Including the religion of Islam and their jihads that hides behind the wall of intimidation to achieve unrecognizable goals.
Sincerely,
Craig
Serious. THAT was well said!
-p
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:11 am
So your saying a nominee to the SC can say ax’d?
Was that the point of that lil post of yours? well done.
Sigh
One more time…..
I am pointing out how quickly the Left strikes at anything they think is politically incorrect; except when it’s from one of their own.
For example:
Only white men should be nominated to the SC because it was white men that wrote the Constitution. Only we have the ability to make good solid decisions….
Try to follow me.
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:30 am
Ive been drinkin… forgive
pino Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:35 am
Ahh, no need. A good drink is good for the soul.
For the record, I think racism is bad. Bad when white men say it and bad when candidates for POTUS say it and bad when nominees to the SCOTUS say it.
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:28 am
That is an excellent point.
Pino/Palin 2012
Kregg Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:16 am
Pino said: Pino/Palin 2012
K: Pino, you better looking than Palin?
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:40 am
LOL. Oh my gawd….check THIS out….
Not only is the media just ognoring radical Islam, they are now running advertisements:
cnn.com/2009/CRIME/06/02/new.york.robber.mercy/index.html
Awesome!
June 3rd, 2009 at 1:56 am
“How else are YOU supposed to know where you stand if you don’t affirm your beliefs in front of people?”
Wow, that’s so weak it’s laughable.
“Palin 2012.”
Now that REALLY proves you hate America.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:09 am
ROCKY,
Weak in your eyes because the only thing you stand for is absolute hatred. You and ERICG are the two people on this site who don’t have to articulate your beliefs because its evident in your constant elementary diatribe.
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:39 am
Pvt. William Long is an American Hero.
Tiller is not. But both murders should be condemed.
Southern Girl Lib Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 9:43 am
He’s a hero to me. I heard on tv from a friend of his that he performed an abortion on a 10 year old who had been raped by her father. Not pretty stuff, but talk about child abuse. If it had happened to me, he would be my hero. The girl is scarred for life, but she’s got a chance at a normal life.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:17 pm
A guy who murdered over 60,000 babies, YES babies is no hero. He and two other clinics, one in california and one in colorado are the only two clinics who offer the barbaric services he offered. The guy became a millionaire by performing infantacide. Do you even have to question why so many practitioners refuse to do what this guy did? Ethics, morals, the hypocratic oath all come to mind.
The girl you speak about is scarred for life for more than one reason.
Southern Girl Lib Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:28 pm
It’s Little Miss Sunshine coming to grace us with her presence laced with cheerful comments and little gems of “wisdom.”
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:42 pm
Well thank you SGL. Glad I could make your day.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:14 pm
Nurse Bliss, I believe it’s the Hippocratic Oath, not the hypocratic oath. Where’d you get medical certification, Wal-Mart?
Can’t remember, how many babies have you adopted to save them from infanticide? Oh, that’s right. You leave it to your friends to do your heavy lifting.
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:32 pm
Sarah, the full Hippocratic Oath bans abortion, by the way.
What does adoption have to do with thinking murder should be illegal? I don’t have to adopt children to think that killing unborn children is grossly immoral.
OldLefty Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:50 pm
The Hippocratic Oath also bans abdominal surgery for kidney an bladder stones:
“I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest;” and swears to pagan Gods.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 9:37 pm
Sarah
When someone like Tiller takes it, it’s the hypocratic oath because he’s a hypocrite.
It’s called a play on words. Where’d you get your sense of irony? Costco?
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:50 pm
The point, Oldlefty, is that abortion was banned in the Hippocratic Oath because it was obviously grossly immoral.
“I will not cut for stone, even for patients in whom the disease is manifest; I will leave this operation to be performed by practitioners, specialists in this art.”
Physicians weren’t surgeons so they didn’t perform surgery.
4moreyears Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:46 pm
Charming blissfulconservative,
Since Karma bears its own fruit you might expect rape and incest in your next lifetime and let’s see who your heroes are then.
Blessings and prayers that your scars are NOT for life.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:51 pm
4moreyears
Well in that case, I suppose you will be an aborted baby? Blessings and and prayers that your scars are not for life. Let’s see who your heroes are then….certainly not the abortion doctor.
Since I don’t believe in reincarnation, I will continue to follow the teachings of Christ which include abstaining from murdering the most innocent.
But it’s nice and easy and quite ignorant to believe and assume that simply having an abortion “fixes” the problem in cases of rape and incest.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:16 pm
I will continue to follow the teachings of Christ…
…as reinterpreted by today’s brand of faux “Christians,” of course.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:19 pm
Sarah
I am sorry if you believe that preserving the most innocent lives, those of unborn children is faux. God teaches that he knows us even in the womb. I am sorry if you believe all that tissue is nothing more than a lump of nothing.
Basic biology. Everything is living or non-living. It is a living human that is growing and forming. It won’t be a worm, cat or dog. The DNA doesn’t change. It is a living human.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:29 pm
And “Blissful” Conservative, I’m sorry you can’t take the hint– I’m calling YOU a faux Christian, period, outside of the abortion debate.
Your hatefulness REPELS people from the religion.
blissfulconservative Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:34 pm
Sarah
You don’t know me so don’t pretend to know me. your posts are so full of bitterness I pucker up everytime I read them.
this coming from someone who wants to take druggies and FORCE them away from their families into treatment against their will? The same person who makes jokes about baby bones in an abortion dr’s teeth? You are a sick puppy. Sick, sick sick.
Glad you think you have the discernment to judge who is or isn’t a faux Christian. Are you God now?
Get a grip. Do you really believe that what you think has an impact on my life?
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:45 pm
Sarah You don’t know me so don’t pretend to know me.
Nope, Bliss, I think I have your number, and pretty accurately at that. You might wish I didn’t.
And luckily, I do know how to spot a faux Christian, thanks to the Gospel (which you might read sometime). You know Jesus, right? The name you enjoy invoking as you speak hatefully to the rest of us, also had a little something to say about your kind, so we could identify faux Christians like you and avoid you like the plague.
And no, unfortunately, I don’t think anything I say will have an impact on your life, just as your attendance at church and your penchant for Bible-quoting hasn’t made you any more of a Christian.
4moreyears Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 6:58 pm
Blissful faux christian conservative, I HAD given that some thought putting that kind of karma forecast out there and it’s reflection. I can’t think of anything more horrible as a punishment than being related to and impregnating you. Let’s hope you are right about reincarnation:)
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 3:09 am
You know Jesus, right? The name you enjoy invoking as you speak hatefully to the rest of us, also had a little something to say about your kind,
—
so what did he say?
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 1:30 pm
I heard from my uncle’s fifth cousin once removed that one time Dr. Tiller smiled and cracked a joke as he was ripping a baby limb-from-limb! What a fantastic, heroic, humanistic physician!
TDro319 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:02 pm
Gee, Flap. You should care as much for our post-born soldiers being killed in Iraq and Afganistan as you do for pre-born fetuses.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:18 pm
And I heard he ate the fetus on pumpernickel with Miracle Whip! And then picked his teeth with the leg bone! All while he was cracking his gum, voting for Al Franken and drinking martinis!
Oh the humanity!
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 3:28 pm
Gee, TDro. Who says I don’t? Just because I’m passionate about the human rights of the unborn has no bearing on any other issue. Do you support any war, ever? Revolutionary War? People DIED. War death is a waaaaay different issue than intentional termination of pregnancy. Why do you keep conflating the two issues?
Let’s say I took the Ron Paul position and said that virtually all war is bad. What would you say then? You’d have no argument, because I bet you know deep down that abortion is horrendous. By admitting that abortion is bad and late-term abortion should be banned you’re not renouncing any of your liberal bona fides. You can still be anti-war, etc.
Sarah, do you think Casey Anthony should be charged with murder? I mean, it was JUST a toddler! Sheesh! Why should we protect toddlers? Obviously that toddler interfered with Casey Anthony’s life. We actually need to protect older, more educated children before we worry about stupid toddlers! Why do we waste police resources on a life that just barely began?
TDro319 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 5:44 pm
Yeah well, Flap, people DIED in wars. Post-born people have died in wars. You’re right about one thing, war death is a waaaaay different issue than abortion – it’s worse!!!!
And no, deep down inside I don’t think abortion is bad and I’ll tell you why. Not a day goes by when I don’t read a newspaper report about a mother drowns her baby or beats it to death. Most of the time she didn’t want the babies in the first place. I’ve read where newborns were left in dumpsters in sub-zero weather.
Therefore, I prefer abortion than to having the post born child suffer a painful death like the ones I listed above.
And one little bit of information: most late term abortions are performed NOT because the mother chose, at the last minute, she didn’t want the baby.
flap Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:58 pm
So because heinous acts are being committed outside of the womb, we should then preempt and replicate those heinous acts inside the womb? It makes absolutely no sense, TDro. And furthermore, why do you give a crap about infants being left in dumpsters when you don’t give a crap about late-term abortions? What the hell is the substantive difference? NONE, TDro.
If we cannot protect life at its very beginning, then why should we protect it outside of the womb? Why should we care? Give me a good reason.
Just because horrendous acts are being committed to young children does NOT justify killing them before they’re born. That’s a warped sense of logic and morality, TDro.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 12:14 am
TDRO,
And one little bit of information: most late term abortions are performed NOT because the mother chose, at the last minute, she didn’t want the baby
I’m very interested to know where you got this info.
Here’s a couple of studies for ya to chew on:
In 1993, the American Medical News– the official newspaper of the AMA– conducted a tape-recorded interview with Dr. Haskell (who has performed more than 1000 late-term or partial birth abortions) concerning this specific abortion method (partial, in which he said:
And I’ll be quite frank: most of my abortions are elective in that 20-24 week range. . . . In my particular case, probably 20% [of this procedure] are for genetic reasons. And the other 80% are purely elective.
Or how ’bout this one:
the Alan Guttmacher Institute (AGI), an affiliate of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America (PPFA), collected questionnaires from 1,900 women who were at abortion clinics procuring abortions. Of the 1,900, “420 had been pregnant for 16 or more weeks.” These 420 women were asked to choose among a menu of reasons why they had not obtained the abortions earlier in their pregnancies. Only two percent (2%) said “a fetal problem was diagnosed late in pregnancy,” compared to 71% who responded “did not recognize that she was pregnant or misjudged gestation,” 48% who said “found it hard to make arrangements,” and 33% who said “was afraid to tell her partner or parents.” = “elective abortions” ["Why Do Women Have Abortions?," Family Planning Perspectives, July/August 1988.]
See…if you had bothered to check for facts before you opined…you would’ve found this gem.
Sorta leads me back to my point that you, among others, fail to base your comments on facts instead of opinion. Good on ya…
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:57 am
Alan said: Let Us Not Forget Another Unnecessary Murder
K: Alan, may I ask what you consider a NECESSARY murder?
trees are people too Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 7:10 pm
Needed to achieve a certain result or effect; requisite: the necessary tools.
The crime of killing a person especially with malice aforethought.
And so, if I may……..a necessary murder would be an action which results in fewer conservative callers hounding Alan and disrupting his propaganda fest which he conducts nightly on Foxnewsradio…………..
Did we get that about right, Alan?
craig7120 Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 9:37 pm
Considering xtian dogma would you 2 gentlemen consider the death of jesus necessary? do you believe it was a murder or suicide?
Kregg Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 10:30 pm
Craig said: Considering xtian dogma would you 2 gentlemen consider the death of jesus necessary? do you believe it was a murder or suicide?
K: According to the Christian religion it was necessary as part of the plan of salvation that Christ die. It depends on your perspective as to whether or not it was murder or not. From the jews’ standpoint they had the ‘malice and forethought’ necessary to convince the Romans to hang Him on the cross. From the Roman standpoint it was an execution done for political reasons. It was not suicide as he did not kill Himself.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 3:05 am
my two cents. Christ freely offered his body as a sacrifice in likeness to and signifying the end of blood sacrifice. You could get into a great deal of semantics about it, but it doesn’t fit the criteria of suicide since he didn’t take his own life, but rather he allowed it to be taken.
The Jewish leaders at the time who made the false accusations and illegal trial, and then applied pressure to contend with Pilate for the death penalty, have at least in some degree committed murder in their hearts. The Romans generally and Pilate specifically were merely instruments, who were weak-minded or otherwise too removed from the implications to really matter.
craig7120 Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 8:42 am
Yeah that suicide had to be thrown in against my better judgement. But im sure you understand why it was inserted. According to the dogma, I was under the impression that Jesus did understand that he was a God. Knowing this of himself couldnt it be considered a suicide act?
Now the murder question seems to be the prefered choice. So in xtian dogma ‘murder’ at least once was necessary.
Trust me when I say im not trying to be demeaning of anyones beliefs or setting up some sort of revelation for anyone to ponder. Its just a personal observation from someone that doesnt practice or follow this dogma.
thanks for the replys Guido n Kregg
Um Cara Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 9:01 am
You could get into a great deal of semantics about it, but it doesn’t fit the criteria of suicide since he didn’t take his own life, but rather he allowed it to be taken.
A guy who jumps into traffic is killed by the car, but it is still suicide. Death by cop is suicide, even though the cop pulls the trigger.
(Both methods of suicide being even more selfish than suicide in general, which is incredibly selfish in and of itself).
So since Jesus was/is all powerful, and it would have been trivial for Him to get loose from the cross, wasn’t the crucifixion a ‘death by cop’ type of suicide?
Though…
I would say a good argument against it being suicide would be to compare it to a soldier who throws himself on a grenade to keep his buddies from being blown up. I don’t think it reasonable to call that ’suicide’.
OK, I just talked myself out of considering the crucifixion suicide – it was more a heroic act of throwing oneself on the proverbial hand grenade.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 9:03 am
was it the holy hand grenade of antioch?
craig7120 Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 9:58 am
Yeah UM that works although if I was in the fox hole with Jesus and 3 idiots and the J-man martyred himself now Im alive but surrounded by idiots and yellin throw another.
ok enough of the religious banter now back to the regular schedule programing already in progress.
trees are people too Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 12:18 pm
Actually Um Cara addresses the point I was going to make…….
A soldier dies while serving his country……
Was the soldiers death necessary?
Was it murder, or suicide?
trees are people too Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
Two problems you have here Craig, the first assumes Jesus was just an ordinary man, and therefore considers that He was never resurrected.
Death was defeated at the Cross when Jesus arose on the third day.
(another example of the Holy Trinity, Guido, stay tuned)
Second, you view is Modalistic.
It is the failing to understand that God did not cease to be God when He added to His nature by inhabiting the flesh.
Modalism is the view that God goes from one form to another because He lacks the ability to be all places at the same time……
God is an inter-dimensional Being.
Jesus used a relational term to demonstrate that He is also a relational Being, “I and the Father are One”…..
He relates within Himself, and He created humans as beings that relate to each other.
He demonstrates hierarchy, while holding that all are co-equal.
Humans are finite beings, and as such they have trouble with infinite concepts….
Try this,
Think of our system of government, three co-equal branches…none of them superior in respect to their inter-relational aspect, but clearly the executive branch has authority…..
Consider that Jesus would represent the Supreme court, The Father the Executive branch, and the Holy Ghost the Legislature, this is an only an analogy, and so it is not an absolutely definitive example…..
The men who founded this country did not stumble on to this concept when they were drafting up our system of Government.
When our first President peacefully transferred the power of the office of the Presidency to a successor it was the first time in human history that ruling power was ever transferred peacefully without the transfer being to a family member of the ruler.
Historically human governmental power was most often transferred through bloodshed.
You have a very finite limited view of who God is and because of that you try to constrain and relegate God.
You only believe in what you directly observe and that is the downfall of Atheism.
There are things that cannot be observed by you, and simply because you can’t see them does not mean that they do not exist……..
craig7120 Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 11:04 pm
Thanks for replyin Trees,
‘You only believe in what you directly observe and that is the downfall of Atheism.
There are things that cannot be observed by you, and simply because you can’t see them does not mean that they do not exist……..’
Your wrong I acknowledge what I see, not believe. you understand the difference.
Now your right on the second point absolutely, but then again if I cant see it neither can you. Unless you have supernatural powers, which I doubt because your on liberaland. I do enjoy your input, you and others are the concrete in my foundation.
GuidoVanHorn Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 4:37 am
Trees,
You’re entire post is a futile attempt of circular and incomprehensible logic.
YOu also falsely presume that I don’t believe in a Trinity…I just don’t believe in the physics of it like you do.
also I’d like to see your biblical proof of the Inter-dimensional being…whatever that means.
Cara…additionally the difference between Jesus and the suicide by cop situation is that suicide by cop insists that the person has put themselves in a situation where the cops would shoot. Jesus did no such thing. The Jewish leaders and the Romans at any time could have decided to stop the proceedings, but did not and actively pursued it. If I had an arrest warrant out for me and I submit to it peacefully, and then the cops kill me, did I partake in “suicide by cop?”
June 3rd, 2009 at 11:39 am
Not surprised I didn’t see a post that read “Are groups that are targeting our soldiers culpable in their murders?” That’s not as sensational I suppose from the liberal standpoint as the other post.
It also detracts from the left’s ability to blame two guys who aren’t in office anymore.
June 3rd, 2009 at 12:44 pm
Well, what can one except from this guy,,,Abdulhakim Mujahid Muhammad a.k.a Carlos Bledsoe. And the four guys in NY that tried to plant bombs in Jewish Houses of Worship. You might want to look up crime stats, FBI.GOV And then look at the most recent census report. These people are 6% of the population and commit about 60% of the violent crimes in this country. This holds true in other countries with a percentage of such types according to interpol. Why?
June 3rd, 2009 at 1:04 pm
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 2:18 pm
And I heard he ate the fetus on pumpernickel with Miracle Whip! And then picked his teeth with the leg bone! All while he was cracking his gum, voting for Al Franken and drinking martinis!
Oh the humanity!
Now that’s funny.
Sarah Reply:
June 3rd, 2009 at 4:53 pm
Thanks, but I guess it was pretty over-the-top, though. I guess this did it: “I heard from my uncle’s fifth cousin once removed that one time Dr. Tiller smiled and cracked a joke ….”
My uncle’s fifth cousin once removed! Now THAT’S funny!
Like, why would anyone believe what HE said? I have it on good authority from my aunt’s third cousin thrice removed that Flap’s uncle’s fifth cousin once removed, is a total boozehound and therefore unreliable!
Ha!
flap Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 12:05 am
SGL said “I heard on tv from a friend of his…” so that’s what I was trying to poke fun of.
It really was a reference to the movie Spaceballs, when Dark Helmet says “I am your father’s brother’s nephew’s cousin’s former roommate.”
Sarah Reply:
June 4th, 2009 at 12:55 pm
Ah, gotcha. I love that show. Mel Brooks is a comic genius.
flap Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 1:40 am
Agreed…Young Frankenstein was fantastic.
michael Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 10:44 am
I always knew you were a good man, flap
flap Reply:
June 5th, 2009 at 3:38 pm
Ha ha, thanks Michael, back at ya bro! ;)
June 3rd, 2009 at 4:48 pm
[...] never happened in Yemen. The officials dealt with me in a gentle way.” Bledsoe/Muhammad is a recent convert to Islam, not someone who was born and steeped in the [...]
June 9th, 2009 at 7:08 pm