Ridge On Record As Disagreeing With BushCo On Raising Threat Levels In 2005
Bush administration officials are predictably blasting Tom Ridge for revelations in his new book that he was pressured to raise terror alerts as a 2004 election ploy. Former Press Secretary Scott McClellan says Ridge had better be able to back his claims. But McClellan also says:
“There is no question exploiting the war on terror was viewed by the political strategists as integral to branding the president as a strong and decisive leader who will keep America safe.”
Ridge said in 2005, at the time he resigned, that he often disagreed with the administration on the need to raise terror alert levels.
The Bush administration periodically put the USA on high alert for terrorist attacks even though then-Homeland Security chief Tom Ridge argued there was only flimsy evidence to justify raising the threat level, Ridge now says.
Ridge, who resigned Feb. 1, said Tuesday that he often disagreed with administration officials who wanted to elevate the threat level to orange, or “high” risk of terrorist attack, but was overruled.
[...]
… There were times when some people were really aggressive about raising it, and we said, ‘For that?’ “
While it was previously reported that Ridge had disagreements about the need to raise threat levels, he hadn’t previously said the push to raise them was politically motivated.
Typical Republicans, working on Peoples fears. They should have their mouth washed out with blackcoal soap.
Hearing Gov.Rendell saying the Ridge would never make up anything like that. He also said the he is one honest politician, and he is in the wrong party…
August 21st, 2009 at 6:26 pm
Good night everyone. No one is on so I will have to close out the computer… See ya tomorrow,
August 21st, 2009 at 9:19 pm
I knew it.
The hack job begins.
The right will now crucify Ridge.
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:56 am
You got that right AJ! The Bushie people are circling the wagon. One IF they admit this, they will admit that they stole the elections once again. Most Republicans will refute this information, but I was watching Keith Olbermann last night and he went down what had happened, in the early days of 2000. It is scary.
If anyone is interested there, there is a new book and it is called “The Dark Side.” it is about the CIA reports on what had happened during the torturing of the detainees. I will get the author and tell you who she is. I want this book, it will P*ss me off and will write to the AG Holder to push to prosecute these criminals.
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:01 am
The author is Jane Mayer, you can go on Amazon and check it out. What I heard she read the CIA information and she wrote about it… I told my husband that I want the book and he agreed. If you
August 21st, 2009 at 10:53 pm
Well who do you blame?
I blame myself.
I wasnt prepared or predicted the fallout of the past presidency. for the individuals that still support the last legacy, good luck on convincing the majority that your side was somehow innocent on what we’re seeing unfold.
Vote!!
August 22nd, 2009 at 1:58 am
So, let me get this straight…
Ridge admits Bush wanted the terror alert raised based on a recent release of a Bin Laden tape that vowed to attack America and direction to kill Bush.
According to Liberals everywhere…there mere declaration of a threat against the US using airplanes would have been justification enough to shut down the nation’s airports, etc in order to prevent this attack.
NOW all of a sudden those same libs are complaining that Bush “politicized” the terror threat by insisting the threat level be raised based on a threat by Bin Laden.
So, which is it? Either you want the president to protect the American people, or you don’t!
psst…I distinctly notice the lack of admission that BOTH sides continuously used the threat of terror as points of discussion during the campaign. Did Kerry “politicize” terror?
Does anyone else find it funny that the Bush/Cheney arguments always seem to crop up when Obama’s poll numbers start to slide? Wait…is the Obama camp politicizing the “politicalization of terror”?
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:01 am
And as usual,Jared makes a 10.0 on 10.0 in the mental gymnastics compeition at Liberaland.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:07 am
“Does anyone else find it funny that the Bush/Cheney arguments always seem to crop up when Obama’s poll numbers start to slide? Wait…is the Obama camp politicizing the “politicalization of terror”?”
A brilliant demonstration of JH Cause effect relationships.So any time anyone tries to do something to hold BushCo accountable, the most recent Obama poll numbers slide is pulled out, and voila, the presence of these 2 statistics together makes a cause-effect relationship, the usual JH way.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:18 am
KARTHIK,
So any time anyone tries to do something to hold BushCo accountable
I’m all for holding Bush accountable. But, what’s the story here KARTHIK? That the threat level WASN’T raised??? C’mon, man. You’ve gotta do better!
I’m reminded of the coincidental timing of the release of “the CIA assassination program that wasn’t” and the hulla-balloo over the cap and trade debate.
This story is yet another attempt by the liberal media to deflect attention away from the angst over the current debate onto something that wasn’t.
Do you not find this story’s timing a bit coincidental, AK?
the usual JH way.
No…you’re wrong because I say so!
the usual AK way.
phillipd Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 1:58 pm
Jared wrote::This story is yet another attempt by the liberal media to deflect attention away from the angst over the current debate onto something that wasn’t”.
You mean like Bush and Cheney did for eight years?
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:26 am
” But, what’s the story here KARTHIK”
The story here is apparent for anyone who can parse English. But I understand you have a problem with that, so let me try your wah.
Grunt…someone ALLEGES Bush told him to raise the threat level BECAUSE the election was round the corner.
The key words are in Upper Case.
Can you now digest what the story here is?
Note:ALLEGES is in upper case. Its a part of the story.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:45 am
KARTHIK,
Yes…I understand the term “allege”…I wonder if you’ve pointed that out to the libs on this site who have accepted this “alleged” pressure as the truth?
So…here’s my take: Ridge “alleges” that Bush pressured him to raise the threat level…but the threat level wasn’t raised. So…it’s all heresay. Makes for good gossip, but is it true? No way to prove it…but that doesn’t stop the media from running with it.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:57 am
“I wonder if you’ve pointed that out to the libs on this site who have accepted this “alleged” pressure as the truth”
I called it as an allegation: That’s as much honesty as you can expect from me.
Its not my job to go around clearing up the air that this is no more than an allegation at this point.
If Bush had been a decent guy in my judgement,I would have done as you asked.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:00 am
If Bush had been a decent guy in my judgement,I would have done as you asked.
so, your standards of accountability are solely based on your judgement of the person in question?
interesting.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:04 am
“so, your standards of accountability are solely based on your judgement of the person in question? ”
This isnt about accountability.
Is clear legally this guy HAS the benefit of doubt(since this is just an allegation at this point).
Does he deserve my time to make it clear to everybody that this is just an allegation?
Excuse me,Its my time, and I will not invest my time in someone I consider scum. Someone I consider a war criminal.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:09 am
I will not invest my time in someone I consider scum. Someone I consider a war criminal.
Like I said…your standard of accountability is based entirely on your judgement of the person in question.
You refuse to tell everyone who takes this claim as fact that it is, in fact, just an allegation because you don’t like Bush. Instead, you allow this misinformation to be propagated without restraint.
Telling…
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:18 am
“Like I said…your standard of accountability is based entirely on your judgement of the person in question. ”
This isnt about accountability,just because you repeat it.
I will only accept a legal judgement on this, because even the scum I believe he is, deserves a chance to represent his case.
That does not make it any obligation of mine to STOP others from believing THIS is evidence.
I wont go and tell them this is evidence, because I dont believe I need to lie to make the case Bush and Cheney are scum.
But if you’re interested in judging my standards of “accountability” (since you insist on using the wrong word for this), judge away, if it makes you happy.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:22 am
Bottom line is this: You do NOT want to hold the majority opinion on this site “accountable” for their distortion of the case because you don’t like Bush.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:31 am
“You do NOT want to hold the majority opinion on this site “accountable” for their distortion of the case ”
There is no question of accountability here: HOW many ever times you misuse that word.
Many people here may BELIEVE Bush is Scum LIKE I do, but they may further believe he doesnt deserve the benefit of the legal process (which I feel he is entitled to).
Who am I to challenge them on their beliefs?Who am I to challenge YOU on your beliefs?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:41 am
AK…
again you go off on an unrelated tantrum. This is an “alleged” issue. Most people who have commented are taking this issue as “this is what happened.”
The “accountability” issue comes into play when you identify the case is based on “alleged” information…but then do NOT hold people “accountable” for pushing incorrect information…because, as you said…you don’t want to waste your time telling them they’re wrong because you don’t like Bush.
This isn’t a question of whether they believe Bush is “scum” or not. It’s a question of whether or not you’re willing to stop the propagation of incorrect information.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:58 am
“It’s a question of whether or not you’re willing to stop the propagation of incorrect information.”
I have to ask you to get off there: on the basis of my beliefs.
It is my belief that the WMD “Intel from multiple sources” was concocted by BushCo to make a case for Iraq 2003.
I believe you havent done anything to stop the propagation of incorrect information from 2003 to date,on that regard.
This is my belief: I dont have the actual facts, because they’re classified.
So, I’ll defer to your request on “incorrect information” when I see you take action on “incorrect information on Iraq 2003 WMD Intel”.
In any case, who are you to tell me what to do?
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 11:03 am
In any case, I dont even need to go into other people’s beliefs.
I will state my own belief:
I believe Bush is CAPABLE of doing what the Allegation says he did.
Do I believe he did it?I dont have a belief for or against it as of now.
When I believe he is CAPABLE of doing this, why should I go around telling other people “this is just an allegation and doesnt have proof,yet”?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 1:46 pm
Dancing again, I see.
You’re personal belief regarding the intel value of WMDs is irrelevant in this discussion.
What IS relevant in this discussion is that Ridge ALLEGES these charges against Bush. HOWEVER, there are those on this website who are arguing as fact: “Bush TOLD him to raise the threat level!”
when I see you take action on “incorrect information on Iraq 2003 WMD Intel”.
Ummm…it’s quite obvious the information regarding WMDs was incorrect as there was no WMDs found. Did you not get that memo?
In any case, who are you to tell me what to do?
Hmmm…so, you’re okay with telling people what to do…but not okay with people telling you what to do.
For example…you tell me that I need to hold FOX news to the same standard that I hold ALAN…but then I ask you to hold people accountable…just in this thread…for pushing bad information; you won’t because you have a personal thing against Bush.
You can try to argue, (ridiculously, I might add) that I don’t have the right to ask you to hold other people accountable for their statements…but you’re all too comfortable holding me accountable for mine.
hypocrite.
phillipd Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 1:54 pm
Bush, Cheney, and KKKristian soldier and Bush/Cheney pet Erik D. Prince ALL belong is a cell for crimes against humanity. Period. Some of the most evil figures history has ever seen as far as I am concerned. They deserve the same consideration that they have shown to the countless innocent men, woman, and children who have been shot, raped, and murdered by some gun for hire thug working for Xe, formely Blackwater. Our country truly should be ashamed.
phillipd Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 1:55 pm
oops, should read “all belong in a cell…” Too much caffeine.. :)
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 3:51 pm
“you tell me that I need to hold FOX news to the same standard that I hold ALAN…but then I ask you to hold people accountable…just in this thread…”
I asked you to hold Fox Accountable. And you refused.
So, on the basis of that refusal, I refuse to hold people accountable especially on BS arguments of yours. I dont even know what forms their BELIEFS, which they have a RIGHT to hold.
WHat nonsense is this,JH? I should dig into people’s minds and hold them accountable…for a belief about a man I believe is SCUM?
You joined the Moral Police today. Flap,Bliss,Trees, you need to give JH a Moral Police welcome Party.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 3:58 pm
“but you’re all too comfortable holding me accountable for mine.”
I asked you to hold Fox news accountable for stuff they SAY.
You refused that.
You asked me to hold people accountable for PRIVATE beliefs of theirs, by eliciting their opinion and placing the facts before them.
Excuse me,why should I oblige you to this length, when you didnt oblige me to go a fraction of the length you asked me to go?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 4:50 pm
I asked you to hold Fox Accountable. And you refused.
Is that your way of justifying your hypocritcal statement: “who are you to tell me what to do?”
Otherwise, I told you I don’t frequent FOX news…but that didn’t seem to be good enough for you. Oh, by the way…I’m still waiting on proof of your claim that I “parrot FOX news” all the time. Given up on that one, then?
I refuse to hold people accountable especially on BS arguments of yours
BS, huh? YOU said you recognized Ridge “alleged” interference by Bush…you also recognized people in this thread viewed this allegation as “truth”. So…once again, in your abject failure to hold people to task for propagating false information…you just affirm your absolute lack of standards for the truth.
I should dig into people’s minds and hold them accountable
Since when did we get into a discussion on what a person believes or not????? The FACTS of the case are that Ridge “alleges” Bush pressured him. Even though there is NO PROOF of this claim…there are people in this thread who are saying Ridge’s claim is true!
This has NOTHING to do with what they believe or not, AK…this is their failure to recognize the facts of the case!
for a belief about a man I believe is SCUM
Your personal belief should have NO BEARING on identifying people’s mischaracterizations of the facts.
You joined the Moral Police today.
I have to work double-time apparently…to cover your LACK of morals.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 4:53 pm
AK,
why should I oblige you to this length, when you didnt oblige me to go a fraction of the length you asked me to go?
I asked you to do the same you asked of me. All of a sudden there are “levels of effort” here? pfft! You just don’t have the cojones to admit your glaring double-standard. You’re one of those “do as I say…not as I do.” people.
Once again…I don’t frequent FOX news. And once again…you fail to prove your claim that I do.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 4:58 pm
“BS, huh? YOU said you recognized Ridge “alleged” interference by Bush…you also recognized people in this thread viewed this allegation as “truth”.”
THe fact that this is an allegation does NOT make their belief UNTRUE. I do not have the evidence to prove their belief to be FALSE. So,I leave them to their beliefs.
“The FACTS of the case are that Ridge “alleges” Bush pressured him. Even though there is NO PROOF of this claim”
And there’s no proof to the contrary either. Therefore, “a belief that this allegation is TRUE ,held by other people” is WRONG cannot be proven unless I use JH logic.
“I asked you to do the same you asked of me.”
Not the same. Even if you dont frequent Fox News, their misrepresentations are open for all to see, as is obvious on a google search.
The private beliefs of others on this issue are NOT open “facts”.
You can go on a mission to gouge them out, you’re on your own there.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 4:59 pm
“So…once again, in your abject failure to hold people to task for propagating false information…”
Propagating false information???
For holding private beliefs that arent even provably wrong, they are propagating False Information?
Sorry Officer of the Moral Police, you are better off taking a walk.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:02 pm
“there are people in this thread who are saying Ridge’s claim is true!”
You have no evidence to disprove a single one of them.
So,quit whining and move on. You’ll get a chance to vote Neocon again, 3 years from now.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:12 pm
“Your personal belief should have NO BEARING on identifying people’s mischaracterizations of the facts.”
OK, lets assess each other on this.
I didnt “speak out” against mischaracterization of “facts that arent even proven yet”.Stemming from my personal beliefs.
Net damage done: Bush’s image as Scum hasnt gotten significantly more worse than it was before.
Now,I brought up the topic of OReilly characterizing the good Dr Tiller as a baby-killer,a man who murdered 60000 babies or whatever, in a past thread. He did this mischaracterization many times.
Dr Tiller was NOT a murderer. That is legal fact. MORE fact than GWBush NOT being Guilty on this allegation.
You did NOT raise a word against it.
The good doctor practicing a legal profession has been assassinated. With clear evidentiary links to OReilly’s mischaracterization of Dr Tiller.
Have we heard from you on this yet?
Didnt think so.
So,Mr Moral Police,try get some moral standards, some perspective, before preaching morals to others.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:21 pm
You have no evidence to disprove a single one of them
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA…this is purely pathetic! Do you know what “allege” means??? It means: unproven. Their argument is unproven. Mine is factual. THEY are taking this story as truth…I’m taking this story as “alleged”. IN THIS CASE, I’m not obligated to “prove them wrong”.
I didnt “speak out” against mischaracterization of “facts that arent even proven yet”.
Oh, really??? Then what did you mean when you said: I called it as an allegation
That’s pretty clear-cut affirmation that their comments are a mischaracterization.
You did NOT raise a word against it.
Really? Can you prove that I “didn’t raise a word against it”??? Just another one of your baseless claims.
try get some moral standards, some perspective, before preaching morals to others.
Yet another joke of the day…YOU telling ME to get some moral standards because I don’t agree with you on a topic. Pathetic…100% pathetic.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:25 pm
” It means: unproven. Their argument is unproven. Mine is factual.”
ROFLMAO: Its factual that their beliefs are wrong?
By JH Standards of Facts, perhaps.
But not by the webster dictionary definition of the word FACT.
“That’s pretty clear-cut affirmation that their comments are a mischaracterization.”
What comments?Show me.
Comments in their minds that you can read through your mind reading abilities?
Comments that are a statement of FACT and not PRIVATE BELIEF(which they are entitled to have,AND express)?
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:26 pm
“YOU telling ME to get some moral standards because I don’t agree with you on a topic”
Dude: We’ve been on the Dr Tiller topic before: I know what you said then.
Quit your moral preaching. Makes you look stupid, after you failed to call OReilly for instigating the murder of the good Dr Tiller.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:39 pm
AK…
this is getting ridiculous…you cannot argue “belief” when “belief” is irrelevant. Are you saying if they “believe” this story is true, then it’s ok???
What comments?Show me.
Start at the top, buddy.
We’ve been on the Dr Tiller topic before: I know what you said then.
Then please…quote me.
Quit your moral preaching. Makes you look stupid, after you failed to call OReilly for instigating the murder of the good Dr Tiller.
Wait…it makes me look stupid to call you out on your apparent lack of standards? You sir, are an liar and a charlatan.
O’Reilly instigated the murder of Tiller, now???? Your proof? I’d LOVE to see your proof! Otherwise, you can keep your piss-ant opinion to yourself.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 5:56 pm
“Start at the top, buddy.”
I havent seen anyone here assert that this allegation was fact.
I have seen a certain idiot try to suggest that because the factuality cant be proven, holding that belief has to be refuted, even though there’s no proof to prove the belief false.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 6:00 pm
I havent seen anyone here assert that this allegation was fact.
Then you don’t know how to read.
I have seen a certain idiot try to suggest that because the factuality cant be proven,
I’ve never said they not entitled to their opinion. HOWEVER, they are claiming “truth” from “allegation”. To which you decided to go off on a completely unrelated tangent of “belief” and that nonsense.
The definition of idiocy is foolish behavior. Introducing an irrelevant argument into a debate is pure idiocy. seems you qualify…and rightly so.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 6:05 pm
” HOWEVER, they are claiming “truth” from “allegation”. ”
The only one seeing a claim of truth is an idiot called Jared.
Show me one message on this thread that asserted anything more than a private belief.
Oh, and thanks for finally acknowledging that people who differ from you in beliefs are actually entitled to have beliefs.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:33 pm
Show me one message on this thread that asserted anything more than a private belief.
Start at the top, buddy.
Thanks for finally acknowledging that people who differ from you in beliefs are actually entitled to have beliefs.
Not that opinion = belief…but you’d do good to take your own advice.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:38 pm
“Start at the top, buddy.”
I did,buddy.
Found nothin.
Are you gonna keep handwaving, or are you going to come up with specifics?
p.s: do you have a complex Re: my holding a PhD? You’ve brought it up every other time since I mentioned it.I can recommend a good therapist.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:51 pm
Found nothin.
Then you don’t know how to read.
are you going to come up with specifics?
Already have…apparently you can’t comprehend English?
do you have a complex Re: my holding a PhD?
Sure I do as you’ve roundly proven that you’re unable to equivalently comprehend/process information on a PhD level. JrHigh maybe…definitely not PhD.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:53 pm
“Already have…apparently you can’t comprehend English?”
Really?I asked you for 1 message, and you asked me to start at the top. That doesnt sound like direction to a specific message. Are you sure you’re speaking English and not Texan?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:54 pm
Start at the top = start with the very first message.
There’s that PhD working again.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:57 pm
“Typical Republicans, working on Peoples fears. They should have their mouth washed out with blackcoal soap.
Hearing Gov.Rendell saying the Ridge would never make up anything like that. He also said the he is one honest politician, and he is in the wrong party…
”
This was from Celtic:
Is there anything here that makes it an assertion of fact?Is there not a clear statement that this was her belief?
I did go to that message, scratch my head, and only then I asked you.
What next?2nd message?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:01 pm
AK,
You poor soul. The common sense part of your degree went unheeded apparently.
Typical Republicans, working on Peoples fears
This statement is apart from the second. Or did you not get that?
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:06 pm
“Typical Republicans, working on Peoples fears”
This is your evidence from the first message? That someone(Celtic) claimed the topic of the thread was fact and not allegation? That she was claiming it was fact, and not her belief?
Tell you what, I’ll give you some advice.
Pick up a GMAT preparatory book, and go through the Reading COmprehension Exercises.
And dont give up if it seems tough, if you find it tough, start lower and work your way up.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:18 pm
AK,
My comprehension skills are fine…it seems that YOURS are lacking and seriously so.
This is a statement of affirmation that Ridge is speaking the truth.
You interpret her statement as her belief…I interpret it as a statement of truth.
You act like a child and berate me for my interpretation of her statement…all the while not realizing that YOUR interpretation of her statement is no more right or wrong than mine. Grow up, kiddo.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:21 pm
“You interpret her statement as her belief…I interpret it as a statement of truth. ”
So you interpret it as a statement of truth?You hold her accountable for what your interpretation says.
My interpretation was consistent with what I said: If anyone said it was FACT, I have SOMETHING to do IF I choose to act on your request. There isnt even ONE message on this thread which seems to me to be ANYTHING more than a statement of belief.
Whom do I hold accountable,JH? Should I get into your mind, figure your interpretation, and hold those people accountable?
All this for the big favor you did me the other day when I asked you to hold Fox accountable and you did…what?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:25 pm
I’ll concede CW’s statement.
here ya go, sparky:
I knew it.
THAT is a statement of fact.
Try to wriggle your way outta this one.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:29 pm
“I knew it.”
Those 3 words make it an assertion of fact?
It again seems like a statement of belief.
JH, you might want to seek psych counselling.
Or we can keep going down message by message.
Or, you can tell me how those 3 words or that statement or that message amounts to an assertion of fact.
You’re off color today,JH.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:34 pm
Unbelievable. You just can’t do it, can you? You just can’t admit that you’re wrong. What – a – baby.
“I knew it” is about as clear a statement of fact as a person can make.
Tell me, AK, is “I won” a statement of belief as well then?
Go ahead and hide behind your ridiculous “statement of belief” bullsh!t if it helps you sleep at night…you’re wrong and you know it.
EricG Reply:
August 23rd, 2009 at 5:09 pm
“Either you want the president to protect the American people, or you don’t!”
It’s all how you do it. If the president has to violate US Law and The Constitution to do it then he has no right and should face charges from the federal government for violating his oath of office. That’s reality and there is much need for cons to face up to the fact that Bush was a disaster president, at best.
“Does anyone else find it funny that the Bush/Cheney arguments always seem to crop up when Obama’s poll numbers start to slide? Wait…is the Obama camp politicizing the “politicalization of terror”?”
Your making mountains out of molehills, Jared.
This issue ‘cropped up’ because Ridge made the claim, not because of some political left agenda.
It wasn’t Obama who wrote the book so your whole argument falls apart before it stands up.
“politicization” by the way…
–
This is an old argument right here.
How bad was Bush? Was he really a war criminal? Should we look into the past or just let all criminals go free when we find it hard to get public support that they pay for their crimes?
I think it is very telling about America as a nation that we will probably never even INVESTIGATE these people.
Basically just like OJ kills two people and goes free … these people will violate the US Law and The US Constitution in absolute terms and just walk away from the murder without a damn thing to pay for.
If your rich or powerful in this nation you do not have to worry about going to jail or ever getting caught for anything you do that is illegal.
What I’m saying is that these days America seems to stand for:
“It’s not illegal as long as you don’t get caught.”
Which sounds more like the mafia to me.
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:59 am
Will the right now put Ridge in the never one of us category alongside Powell and McCallan ?
I think the answer is obvious.
Where is Kregg?
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:41 am
AJ; Ridge is a centist, he is and never was a conservative. He never abolished Abortions here, he signed an executive order to put the men on deathrow to death by lethal injection. He was only my Governor for about six years until he became the first Secretary of Homeland Security.
I believe Poweel and McCallen were also Cenrist.
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:13 am
Timeout JH: The boss needs me.
Celtic, are you here?Does this game have a timer?I think I’ve won today’s game.
Who is the referree, what is the referree doing?
phillipd Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 6:29 pm
I lost count, but JH is rambling his usual diatribe….I think I drifted off at 5 for K and O for JH. :)
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:36 pm
JH is rambling his usual diatribe
That’s funny because I’ve said nothing that isn’t factually correct. Good job acknowledging you’ve neither a sense of nor wont for factual information, PHILLIP.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:42 pm
If you dont mind,Phillip,I’ll like to step in:
Here’s what I found when I got to the top of the thread:
“A brilliant demonstration of JH Cause effect relationships.So any time anyone tries to do something to hold BushCo accountable, the most recent Obama poll numbers slide is pulled out, and voila, the presence of these 2 statistics together makes a cause-effect relationship, the usual JH way.”
We actually drifted from this topic, at the top of the thread. A factual demonstration from JH showing how the reports on BushCo were directly correlated to polls on Obama’s approvals sliding, with evidence pulled from his a$$.
Yes, JH, you’ve been presenting facts. JH Facts.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 7:59 pm
AK,
We’ve drifted from the original topic because that’s your proven modus operandi. Typical of you to shift the topic away from an inconvenient truth to a subject that you’ve proven you know very little about otherwise.
That statement you pulled out was a question to the readers…and not a statement of fact. It was designed to illicit a response to get a debate going…and congratulations…you fell head first into it.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:03 pm
Oooh, Mr JH wants to be buried alive in his $hit.
Well, its your choice.
“This story is yet another attempt by the liberal media to deflect attention away from the angst over the current debate onto something that wasn’t.
Do you not find this story’s timing a bit coincidental, AK?
”
Now, who was it who claimed this story was an attempt to deflect attention, with JH proof of 2 separate statistics and a BS argument of coincidental timing? Your Alter Ego?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:22 pm
AK,
now you’re talking out of your arse. AGAIN parsing my statement to form your argument.
Try again, kiddo.
Here, I’ll even help you out…yet again:
“Does anyone else find it funny that the Bush/Cheney arguments always seem to crop up when Obama’s poll numbers start to slide? Wait…is the Obama camp politicizing the “politicalization of terror”?”
Now that you have my ENTIRE quote…I’ll thank you to be a grown up and comment on my ENTIRE quote and NOT PARSE it to fit your agenda.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:25 pm
I guess it was your Alter Ego.
Tell him/her I said Hi.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:30 pm
I’ll take that as a concession that you DID parse my statements to fit your argument. Good for you.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:32 pm
“I’ll take that as a concession that you DID parse my statements to fit your argument.”
Its your mind JH.
You can parse statements of belief as fact,you can pass my message as a concession, who am I to stop your mind from imagining whatever it wants to imagine?
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:04 pm
That’s funny…still no concession of you’re obvious fallacious parsing/rewording of my comments to make your point. Pitiful.
Unlike you…I’m man enough to concede when I’m wrong. You’ve got a long way to go, apparently.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:08 pm
“That’s funny…still no concession of you’re obvious fallacious parsing/rewording of my comments to make your point”
There was nothing fallacious or reworded about your words.
They are your words.
“This story is yet another attempt by the liberal media to deflect attention away from the angst over the current debate onto something that wasn’t.
Do you not find this story’s timing a bit coincidental, AK?
”
”
Who asked you to insist there was a relationship?You could’ve stated you believe so. Like everyone else here did.
You’re the one conjuring up facts when all you have is beliefs.
“That’s funny because I’ve said nothing that isn’t factually correct.”
I didnt claim to be touting facts. You’re the one touting your opinions as facts.
Such as the biased sample. Oh, we’re waiting on your evidence of sample bias.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:11 pm
“Unlike you…I’m man enough to concede when I’m wrong.”
Oh. I didnt know one had to be a man to concede one was wrong.
Lucky then I’m a man.
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 6:44 pm
sorry Karth had to go out awhile, food…,
August 22nd, 2009 at 6:27 pm
Karth, was Jared talking about Ridge and what I had said? Why wouldn’t Rendell know Ridge, He was a Mayor when Ridge was Governor. The two are friends and both from the State I reside in. He was my Governor. I had no problem with him did not know he was around, I only seen his name on a lottery ticket.
We did flurish under Clinton and Ridge, we had jobs in Pennyslvania.
I made a comment to what I had heard, and then Jared you complain? Damn man, Bush was once YOUR Gov.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:55 pm
Celtic:
He was just talking out of his a$$. Waving his hands like there’s evidence everywhere on this thread.
As I said before, its 1 thing to say “I have a RIGHT to my beliefs and you have a RIGHT to yours.”
Its a different thing to live up to that statement.
Its my BELIEF(Did u digest that JH?) that he does not live up to that statement.
Its my BELIEF(again, note the key word JH) that he lives by “My beliefs are my RIGHT, and I dont have to be accountable to anyone for those beliefs(which is exactly what I believe,too), but the same time, others have to justify their beliefs or they’re immoral people,because he’s the moral standard.”
I also believe its POSSIBLE JH believes I’m a paedophile.
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:05 pm
nah, you just have a wife to do that job…<:)
Ridge was my Governor for 7 years, because Rendell won the the Governorship and next year would be his last year. Who is up for that job, don't know.
Under Ridge we did have jobs, but that was also the time of Clinton also, and Pennsylvania is usually the last to get stimilated with some sort of jobs. We are an industrial state, yeah we have Hershey, we have Two championship teams, one baseball and one football, we have Tasty kakes. Philly has the Liberty Bell, Independence Hall, but hey, the true Declaration Of Indendence is not there.
So each of us has our OWN beliefs, that is what makes us unique. Imagine if we all believed in the same thing? BORING!!!
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:06 pm
Hey…jacka$$…I’ve already admitted my mistake. Your childish temper tantrum here only serves to highlight your utter lack of maturity.
Grow up and act like an adult for a change.
EricG Reply:
August 23rd, 2009 at 5:13 pm
“Your childish temper tantrum here only serves to highlight your utter lack of maturity. Grow up and act like an adult for a change.”
Do you mind if I say that to Limbaugh, O’Reilly, Ingram, Hannity, Savage, etc.?
Because that’s what conservative media is these days. Children and their pack of lies with a side order of stupid partisan jokes and the occasional racist, sexist or bigoted remark.
Celticwitch Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:09 pm
That is alright, We have our own Beliefs, can you imagine if we were all the Same? BORING!!!
Look Ridge had one more year when he was tapped for the First Secretary of Homeland Security. He was not a bad Governor, did not see him much. We did have jobs in Pennsylvania, but Clinton also was President at the time.
Well Good luck… Keep up the good work!
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:11 pm
Its a different thing to live up to that statement.
Obviously…
I don’t want to hear another word come out of your bigoted mouth regrading O’Reilly calling Tiller a killer then. After all, it is HIS belief. according to YOU…YOU do NOT have the right to question his belief.
I don’t want to hear another word come out of your bigoted mouth regarding my views on how to fix the economy. After all…it IS my belief.
I don’t want to hear another claim from you indicating that I espouse the same views as FOX. After all…it WOULD be my belief (if it were true)
Hypocrite.
EricG Reply:
August 23rd, 2009 at 5:17 pm
“I don’t want to hear another word come out of your bigoted mouth regarding my views on how to fix the economy. After all…it IS my belief.”
Jared,
I feel you on how people put words in your mouth or assume much about you because you favor one side or the other in a political discussion.
But you read this site much?
I’ve had that very thing done to me time and time again by viscous and moronic conservatives out to put words in my mouth and explain how I think to everyone.
It’s just like listening to the Baloney King Bill O’Reilly if you wanted to learn about liberals. It’s a waste of everyone’s time.
Nobody is fit to talk about Jared’s point of view except Jared. But that goes every which way.
Nobody, I mean NOBODY, is fit to tell you about I think or what liberals in general think except me or another liberal.
So do you see now why I call the majority of the people at FOX News and on AM radio a bunch of liars?
They spend all day telling us both what the Democrats and the Liberal Movement are planning and the whole agenda of these people but they are in fact making stuff up. Thus they are lying to us both and there is no excuse.
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:16 pm
“After all, it is HIS belief. according to YOU…YOU do NOT have the right to question his belief”
Dude: Am married.
If my wife needs an abortion, and I need to go out of the way for it,am sure as hell taking OReilly to court for taking away my option of getting my wife attended to by the good Dr Tiller, through his propaganda which I sure as hell will claim led to Dr Tiller’s assassination.
I dont care if I am laughed out of court. I dont care if he gets away; He probably will get away with it.
“I don’t want to hear another word come out of your bigoted mouth regrading O’Reilly calling Tiller a killer then”
During my Electrical Engineering days,I tried the same thing you just tried, on a classmate of mine.He responded with some golden words I will just quote here:
“I have free bandwidth and will continue to transmit. If you dont like my broadcast,shut down your receiver”.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 23rd, 2009 at 10:09 am
“I have free bandwidth and will continue to transmit. If you dont like my broadcast,shut down your receiver”.
I’ll remember you said this.
JaredfromTexas Reply:
August 23rd, 2009 at 8:11 pm
AK,
As if we needed any more proof of your blatant hypocrisy and bigotry…
This is a quote from you two days ago:
Anyone who argues causality without proof is an idiot
Then just yesterday you say:
…[O'Reilly's] propaganda which I sure as hell will claim led to Dr Tiller’s assassination.
Tada…
(this is where you enter full-spin mode: “No…no…what I mean was…what I was thinking was…”)
August 22nd, 2009 at 8:18 pm
hey guys fight nice, but it is time to say goodnight, and see ya here tomorrow,
karthiks030977 Reply:
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:18 pm
Gnight Celtic. Am off too,gnight everyone.
August 22nd, 2009 at 9:14 pm
OBL is dead since—-.
And they knew.
August 22nd, 2009 at 10:29 pm
Well it’s no big secret that I’m no fan of Bush and everything they did in office so I find no trouble at all in believing Ridge in this matter.
It seems perfectly fitting to me.
In an admin where they lied about torture and WMDs they surely could make room in their barrel of corruption for political corruption.
I see Bush as just Nixon top the extreme of actually putting the nation in jeopardy with his lack of leadership and complete corrupt agenda. But I never claimed to be some unbiased source on the matter.
August 23rd, 2009 at 5:00 pm